In the Thread by smellycat ‘leaving your father and mother’, discussion drifted off topic somewhat,(my fault) so I have abandoned it and started a thread which I hope will better accommodate the direction of drift from the original.
The topic of interest comes down to this: Will the majority of mankind spend eternity with the Lord or will the majority be eternally separated from the Lord?
If we could go back to Judea and ask Jesus point blanc this question here is what he might say, as is recorded by Luke 13: 24“Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. 25When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from,’ 26then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’ 27But He will say, ‘I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’ 28There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, and yourselves thrust out. 29They will come from the east and the west, from the north and the south, and sit down in the kingdom of God. 30And indeed there are last who will be first, and there are first who will be last.”
This is similar to His teaching as recorded by Matthew 7:13-14. But is it the same teaching as in Luke 13, or an entirely new one? I consider that it is the same teaching stated in slightly different terms.
Without going in for a word by word exposition, we can see that there are a few things that stand out plainly for us to understand. Firstly Jesus is warning against procrastination, secondly, His use of the idea of peoples coming from all four points of the compass tells us that though there are ‘many’ (procrastinators), in contrast there will be many (myriads?) of people from all over who will be saved. This in itself tells us little of the relative balance of saved versus unsaved, but I think it does indicate that there will be a substantial number of saved souls.
Yet again Hosea records the Word of the Lord: Hos 1: 10“Yet the number of the children of Israel Shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured or numbered. And it shall come to pass in the place where it was said to them, ‘You are not My people,’ There it shall be said to them, ‘You are sons of the living God.’
Again Jude says this: Jude 1:14-15 Now Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men also, saying, “Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints, 15to execute judgment on all, to convict all who are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have committed in an ungodly way, and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.”
Again, an allusion to an indefinitely large number of saints.
The question before us is: Is there a direct and unarguable statement as to the proportion of mankind that will not be saved? As for myself, I believe that there will be more saved than lost……but that is me.
I would hasten to state that personally do not countenance any form of doctrine like ‘universal salvation’ a la Roger Tutt et al.
I am interested in any thoughts from others be they opposite or supportive.
Blessings,
calvin
The topic of interest comes down to this: Will the majority of mankind spend eternity with the Lord or will the majority be eternally separated from the Lord?
If we could go back to Judea and ask Jesus point blanc this question here is what he might say, as is recorded by Luke 13: 24“Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. 25When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from,’ 26then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’ 27But He will say, ‘I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’ 28There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, and yourselves thrust out. 29They will come from the east and the west, from the north and the south, and sit down in the kingdom of God. 30And indeed there are last who will be first, and there are first who will be last.”
This is similar to His teaching as recorded by Matthew 7:13-14. But is it the same teaching as in Luke 13, or an entirely new one? I consider that it is the same teaching stated in slightly different terms.
Without going in for a word by word exposition, we can see that there are a few things that stand out plainly for us to understand. Firstly Jesus is warning against procrastination, secondly, His use of the idea of peoples coming from all four points of the compass tells us that though there are ‘many’ (procrastinators), in contrast there will be many (myriads?) of people from all over who will be saved. This in itself tells us little of the relative balance of saved versus unsaved, but I think it does indicate that there will be a substantial number of saved souls.
Yet again Hosea records the Word of the Lord: Hos 1: 10“Yet the number of the children of Israel Shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured or numbered. And it shall come to pass in the place where it was said to them, ‘You are not My people,’ There it shall be said to them, ‘You are sons of the living God.’
Again Jude says this: Jude 1:14-15 Now Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men also, saying, “Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints, 15to execute judgment on all, to convict all who are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have committed in an ungodly way, and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.”
Again, an allusion to an indefinitely large number of saints.
The question before us is: Is there a direct and unarguable statement as to the proportion of mankind that will not be saved? As for myself, I believe that there will be more saved than lost……but that is me.
I would hasten to state that personally do not countenance any form of doctrine like ‘universal salvation’ a la Roger Tutt et al.
I am interested in any thoughts from others be they opposite or supportive.
Blessings,
calvin