Contradictions In The Bible???

[rev3lations]

You're right, but I have given christianity 13 years. Been going to christian forums for a long time and this love christians claim only they have is a lie.

All the time I spent in christian forums really opened my eyes to all the judgmental fundemental bible thumping my brand of faith is true B S and its here too.

I just came here to make sure I wanted to leave and you will end up doing the same thing if you ever leave christianity.

Let me put it this way so you will understand how hard it is to leave jesus.

Lets say you were a adopted child and you never knew who your real family were, then one day out of the blue a man shows up and tells you he is your real father. You however are so overwelmed that your real father has showed up you take him at his word and because you feel such a great weight has been lifted off your life you accept him strait away.

Things go really well for a while but soon enough this man starts tellings you strange things about his past and why he is here, you shrug it off and say, its just my father but he still loves me. As more time goes on this man starts demanding that you invite him to all your family and friends, so you do because well he is your father and because you think it will be good if everyone meets him.

But it does not stop there, he gets more demanding asking you your family and your friends for all there time and money and to do exactly what he says. Then some of your friends start telling you that your father has been leaving threats on there answering machine telling them if they don't do what he says he will burn them alive.

From here you are conflicted, you love your father so much and you lost him once and you don't want to lose him again.

What do you do?

Well the first thing I did is find out if this man really was my father.

 

[aha]

Let me put it this way so you will understand how hard it is to leave jesus.

I try to seek the righteousness, and not the un-righteousness: what we seek is what we will find.

although do we look or we are found? that will be another story/topic....
One thing I learned about belief is that it follows Newton first law of motion:

…. an object in motion stays in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force.

 

[rev3lations]

I try to seek the righteousness, and not the un-righteousness: what we seek is what we will find.

although do we look or we are found? that will be another story/topic....
One thing I learned about belief is that it follows Newton first law of motion:

…. an object in motion stays in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force.

Strange, anyway I realised that god was never going to help me and no amount of praying was going to change what I had to do myself. God is like the 12 step program in that it strips you of any power to get better yourself and makes you a slave to the program. It might work for alot of people but it sure fails aswell, although the 12 step cultists will tell you it wont ever fail so long as you work there 12 laws.

 

[Major]

You're right, but I have given christianity 13 years. Been going to christian forums for a long time and this love christians claim only they have is a lie.

All the time I spent in christian forums really opened my eyes to all the judgmental fundemental bible thumping my brand of faith is true B S and its here too.

I just came here to make sure I wanted to leave and you will end up doing the same thing if you ever leave christianity.

Let me put it this way so you will understand how hard it is to leave jesus.

Lets say you were a adopted child and you never knew who your real family were, then one day out of the blue a man shows up and tells you he is your real father. You however are so overwelmed that your real father has showed up you take him at his word and because you feel such a great weight has been lifted off your life you accept him strait away.

Things go really well for a while but soon enough this man starts tellings you strange things about his past and why he is here, you shrug it off and say, its just my father but he still loves me. As more time goes on this man starts demanding that you invite him to all your family and friends, so you do because well he is your father and because you think it will be good if everyone meets him.

But it does not stop there, he gets more demanding asking you your family and your friends for all there time and money and to do exactly what he says. Then some of your friends start telling you that your father has been leaving threats on there answering machine telling them if they don't do what he says he will burn them alive.

From here you are conflicted, you love your father so much and you lost him once and you don't want to lose him again.

What do you do?

Well the first thing I did is find out if this man really was my father.

IMO you have a pyscological problem my friend which from your own words seem to be rooted in your past from the way you were treated.

You have commented several times on the same thing about your father and family etc. I suggest your seek out a Christian
therapist who can help you through this clinical problem that it tormenting your soul.

You, no one, can find a cure on a computer web site. Life is just not that simple.

 

[Major]

I think it would be wise of me to answer your question by the use of simpler words

You are to good to me calvin.

 

[rev3lations]

IMO you have a pyscological problem my friend which from your own words seem to be rooted in your past from the way you were treated.

You have commented several times on the same thing about your father and family etc. I suggest your seek out a Christian
therapist who can help you through this clinical problem that it tormenting your soul.

You, no one, can find a cure on a computer web site. Life is just not that simple.

Who doesnt have issues, I love my father very much, but it took along time to get there. But I only started to love him when I took my eyes off jesus. Because now I don't see people as evil sinfull brutes and I don't have to treat them in a way that they should messure up to jesus or his teachings all the time.

 

[rev3lations]

I find it amusing when christians play the, you' re the head case card. Should I even remind you who your saviour came for?

So then you must be a head case too or jesus is going to pass you right by.

 

[KingJ]

But it does not stop there, he gets more demanding asking you your family and your friends for all there time and money and to do exactly what he says.

You have the wrong idea of God. God is not demanding. The fruit of the Spirit (God) is Gal 5:22-23 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control.

If you are not convicted to give time and money, then you are not convicted. You cannot fake love and God doesn't expect you to! If you give with a bad heart, you waste your money. We CHOOSE to give time and money because we LOVE God. You think God can't see our hearts intent? God prefers you cold if you can't be hot. No offence but serving God sounds like so much effort for you. Get on your knees and open your heart to God. Stop leaving the depth of your relationship with God at what prosperity type teachers teach you. We are either in love with God or we are not! When you love someone, there is no such thing as effort needed, rather you can't contain yourself and want to do everything for them. Want to tell everyone about Him and are hurt / confused / sad when others don't experience / have what you do. God is not dumb. God is not evil. God is not a control freak. God does not need your money. God does not want to be in your life unless you want Him to. God is good. God is patient. God is long-suffering. God is merciful. God is overflowing with love for us.

father has been leaving threats on there answering machine telling them if they don't do what he says he will burn them alive

The alternative to 'no hell' is either 1. God is partial, 2. God did not create you or 3. God made you at a monkey's intelligence. Which would you prefer? Being with or without God is a reality we all have to face and just accept that it is an inevitable consequence of being the creation we are. I am glad to be a human with high intelligence.

As for suffering in hell. Please just ''get it''. God is good. He was good before He made us. He is good right now. He will be good in the after-life too. God will be just and fair on all those in hell. Nobody that goes to hell would ever want to be with God! Nobody that goes to heaven would ever want to be without God. God is simply NOT stupid. Your insinuations are terrible! .

 

[Major]

Who doesnt have issues, I love my father very much, but it took along time to get there. But I only started to love him when I took my eyes off jesus. Because now I don't see people as evil sinfull brutes and I don't have to treat them in a way that they should messure up to jesus or his teachings all the time.

Absolutly correct Rev. We, me all have problems and emotional concerns. Do you not see from your own words the problem?

You just said once again.............
" I love my father very much, but it took along time to get there."

Then you blaimed that situation on God by saying..............
"But I only started to love him when I took my eyes off jesus." (Jesus)

Your premise is completely upside down my friend. God is love and Jesus is love in action. I do not know what has happened to you but it is obviouse that it was something very deep and harmful.

You blaim God, you blaime Jesus, you bliam everyone but YOU. You are blaiming God for what YOU are responsible for!

 

[Major]

I find it amusing when christians play the, you' re the head case card. Should I even remind you who your saviour came for?

So then you must be a head case too or jesus is going to pass you right by.

Once again you are correct. Jesus came to seek and save the lost of which I am the worst. "I" admit that!

I was all kinds of cases. Head, body-- you name it and I was it. BUT there comes a day of reckoning where every single person must come to grips with his own actions or lack there of and realize that their problems are their problems. Then we can begin to fix those problems and stop blaiming God.

The first thing I fixed was my eternal home. I choose to go to heaven to be with God.

You can do that as well by believing upon and accepting Christ.

 

[rev3lations]

I can't say I am a perfect thinker but I am thinking for myself. No, you love him because you think you will get the eternal smoking section if you don't. Just tell me this are you not afraid of what god will do to you if you live your life your way and love people freely, not from god and not out of contrition.

 

[rev3lations]

Ill keep talking till my account get closed.

 

[Panda]

We don't love God because of fear of Hell. Hell does not exist for that reason, and Hell is never, ever talked about to make us "love" more. Hell is incapable of producing Love or Compassion. I can't answer why Hell exists. It's not something anyone like to think about, but I can say that we know about Hell so that we know the importance of helping others stay out of such a dreadful place. Hell has no place in a Christian's heart, and so we have no fear of it, nor does it compel us to love.

However, you cannot experience love on a forum, I don't care what the interweb tries to tell you. You can experience bickering and differences. I do my best to keep that at a minimum, but we are all people of passion. We feel strongly about our beliefs and opinions. We are committed to our paths, and so there is sometimes disagreements that get heated.

I am not afraid of what God will do to me no matter what. I trust my God. I trust Him completely. If He wants to destroy me, then I trust Him to do so. Yet, He has never harmed me. I've made some stupid decisions, and I've definitely brought harm to myself, but God has not harmed me. I don't quite understand your antagonism. I get that you are frustrated, but I can also say with certainty that if you are experimenting with Christianity, then you have never committed. Religion isn't a "try and see" experience. Very few things worth doing are. It's a commitment. Even if you look at the base subject of this thread, it is about commitment. Some have committed to a particular way of reading Scripture, and others commit to a different interpretation. The different views don't work on every level, but we all agree on the most important aspects, and that is that Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. Anyone who enters into Heaven uses that gate.

As for Hell, well, that is more controversial. I affirm Hell, as do most Christians, but the details are widely interpreted differently. I get into more deep theological discussions about Hell than any other topic, and I'm a person who is very heavily committed to certain topics. Hell is not about Love. It is not about respect. It is a reminder to us how important it is to keep people from going there. It is a call to action, but not a place for us to fear, but a place to break our hearts for those that have chosen to reject God.

 

[Panda]

Ill keep talking till my account get closed.

If you really insist, I CAN close your account, but since you didn't specifically ask me (I'm guessing you sent your message to Jeff or HMS?), I'd honestly rather you stay and participate. So long as you are seeking answers, I'd rather you contribute than apply a strict rule to prevent you from returning. We all struggle to find answers, the only difference here, is that you are honest with your struggle.

 

[KingJ]

I can't say I am a perfect thinker but I am thinking for myself. No, you love him because you think you will get the eternal smoking section if you don't.

No, I approve of who He is and what He did proved who He says He is to be true. Before I was saved I had loads of apathy and arrogance. 'If our lives are evil and God punishes evil with hell then God is evi'l...I had that view but looking back I can say it is perhaps the most narrow minded view one can have. You have to ignore the reality all around you. Like the fact that He made you....the fact that you are not suffering His wrath right now.....I could go on all day.

Just tell me this are you not afraid of what god will do to you if you live your life your way and love people freely, not from god and not out of contrition.

You need to face reality my friend. There is a God and there is a devil. You may think you are living ''your'' way but your hearts intent is either geared to live a life that pleases God or the devil. Everyday you wake up you make a choice to submit to God and react in a Godly manner to all (humlity, self sacrificing) or live for yourself...which is a snowball effect to pride, arrogance and a hard heart.

 

[aha]

No, you love him because you think you will get the eternal smoking section if you don't.

I was never afraid of hell…. I always think that God is smarter than me…
there is one consistent flaw in your argument....faulty generalization: all fundamentalist, all christians forums....
and hmmm...... all who do not agree with me are cultist : )

 

[calvin]

I can't say I am a perfect thinker but I am thinking for myself. No, you love him because you think you will get the eternal smoking section if you don't. Just tell me this are you not afraid of what god will do to you if you live your life your way and love people freely, not from god and not out of contrition.

Well since you have not responded to my earlier comments, I'll just wade in at this point rev3lations.
There is nowhere God has said "I'm going to torment/punish people I don't like for ever and ever." Do you know of any scripture that reports this? No you don't because...simply put, it does not exist.
certain people will be tormented eternally, but not by the Lord, rather by themselves and the choices they are making now in this life.
Jesus has paid the price in His own body for our sin.
What life choice are we, are you going to make?
If a person rejects Jesus now, in this life then they will in turn be rejected later.
Now that is fair isn't it?
But when those who have rejected Jesus finally see what they are missing out on eternally, then their torment will come from within themselves with the full knowledge that it is because of the choices they made in this life.
There will be no torment perpetrated by the Lord.
Read carefully again all your favourite torment passages. Do they not simply say that those rejected will be tormented? Do they not fail to say that it will be the Lord who torments these people? Too many people, too often level unjustifiable criticism against the Lord, the one who suffered that they might not suffer.
Think it over pal.

 

[Major]

I can't say I am a perfect thinker but I am thinking for myself. No, you love him because you think you will get the eternal smoking section if you don't. Just tell me this are you not afraid of what god will do to you if you live your life your way and love people freely, not from god and not out of contrition.

I can tell you for a fact that I do not fear what God will do to me. I have believed what He promised me.

Since I have the Gift of the Holy Spirit in me, I can not feel the way you are describing.

 

[rev3lations]

If you really insist, I CAN close your account, but since you didn't specifically ask me (I'm guessing you sent your message to Jeff or HMS?), I'd honestly rather you stay and participate. So long as you are seeking answers, I'd rather you contribute than apply a strict rule to prevent you from returning. We all struggle to find answers, the only difference here, is that you are honest with your struggle.

Yes please close my account and you can all go back to your normal debates.

 

[Panda]

Reading back through this topic, I have to say, I'm not seeing the type of loving, Christian example that I would expect from mature Christians. Instead of ministering to a man who is obviously conflicted and hurting, what I see is people ARGUING with him. How can you not feel compassion for him? How can you possibly think that the best option here is to dig into your doctrines? What Spirit has told you that it is more important for you to make you point rather than help a drowning soul? Have you all become so accustomed to fighting among yourselves that you don't even know how to reach out to someone seeking answers? Almost daily, I wonder if there was any point in me returning to this site at all and have to be reminded that I didn't return for myself but because God has some purpose for it. Some days, I honestly hope that purpose can be fulfilled so I can just move on because the attitudes and lack of love from those claiming to follow Christ's example is really heart wrenching for me and pain me daily.