No, scripture calls the body of sin the "Old Man" or what we call 'sin nature'.
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It is the soul that is responsible for the things done in the body. Whatever the soul desires, the body is used to fulfill it. The soul cannot live on earth without a body. Man is body, soul and spirit. These three are one. When the soul departs the body it goes into eternity; whether that be heaven or hell. The body that gave it life goes back to the dust from whence it came. Man's soul is expressed in this world through a body. It was the soul that was held in captivity by the spirit of bondage before salvation. It is also the soul that cries out to God for deliverance.
Psalm 6:4 Return, O LORD, deliver my soul: oh save me for thy mercies’ sake.
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I am assuming you are saying that the heart (spirit) and soul are the same? Man's personality resides in man'soul, so does also his emotions and right to choose.
How ever, how do we reconcile this scripture that tells us that the soul, spirit, and body are all separate from each other?
Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
This is what I mean by vocabulary issue. I don't want to make assumptions, but I would suggest that when people talk about "sin nature," generally they mean the same thing that you mean when you say "soul desires." If I were to talk about "sin nature," I would be talking about what you call the "soul's desires." I mean, if the soul desires something sinful, I think you can understand why people would think of that as a "nature."
Let me put in another way: if someone says to you that they rely on the Spirit of God to deny temptation, can they confidently think of themselves as "sons of God," or do they actually need use the terms you use (which don't seem to be the terms the Bible uses) by which to understand that process?
Or to put it another way, does Christ's ability to save us depend on our own ability to correctly understand, identify, categorize and label all the elements of the process of salvation?
At salvation, the soul or innerman which had been previously held captive by the power of sin and death, is placed inside the Holy Ghost. That is why oftentimes soul and spirit are used interchangeably or seems so much the same you can hardly discern the difference. That is why the Word says it takes the Word of God to DIVIDE IT.
I do not see sin nature as soul desires. A Nature is the identity, make up, character, essence or if you will, DNA or Genes of a person. For example, the nature of a dog is to bark. He has the nature of a dog. He does not meow because his nature is to bark. Another example: it is not the nature of a born again son of God to sin. His father is the God of this universe. His desires are not that of continually being out in the world and sinning. His nature is one of holiness and love, just like his daddy.
By saying a son of God has a Sin Nature is like saying his desires are of the devil and he belongs to the devil. The devil is his father and the son of God has his dna. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do....John 8:44
And no, one does not need to use my words or terms to be saved.
LOLSo, can we safely say that man,s heart (spirit), soul, and body are all separate from each other, and the only way we can tell the difference between our soul, and spirit is as we grow in the Lord, and become more mature in our understanding, to be able discern the difference from the two? If the soul of man desires anything then it would had to get this desire either from the body of flesh, or Christ which is now our new life.
What I am trying to point out is we are either influenced by light or darkness. There is no middle ground, or gray area.
There is no light, me, and darkness, it either light or darkness. Me own my own does not exist.
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And no, one does not need to use my words or terms to be saved.
I'm glad! And I strongly suspect that people are saying a pretty similar thing, if not the same thing, just with different terms.
Wait... Jesus changes our DNA? Before the resurrection body?
I think when most people refer to "sin nature" they would probably qualify, we have the same desires, but we don't need to be slaves to them. So in that sense, I don't thinking people are actually saying that "his desires are of the devil and he belongs to the devil." I don't know, though. You could ask them if that's what they mean. Whether we say those desires come from our "flesh" or our "soul" seems irrelevant in practical application: either way, you still have temptation, which comes from you, and you still need to turn to the Spirit to deny that temptation, and not yourself. So whatever you decide to name those concepts, the practical reality is identical.
I agree with all you said until I got to the last sentence. In the salvation process we are raised complete in Christ, body soul and spirit. The body of sin was destroyed in this process and the body of the New Man no longer is held captive to sin. The body is free to serve God in righteousness and holiness because it has been cleansed inside of the circumsicion of the flesh. We are raised a completely New Man in Christ. No longer does the flesh have the power to pull us into captivity and sin. The motions of sin and body of sin was destroyed at salvation. The desires do not come from flesh anymore but from the soul. The body is a vehicle which is used by the New Creature to move about this earth. Upon death, the body goes back to the dust. The body is not judged. It is the soul that stands before God.
Sister, are we not waiting to know the redemption of our body? The body of sin has been destroyed, yet we are still surrounded by it in this life. The power of sin which is in our flesh can no longer force us to do those we now hate. Yet we have been "circumcised with the circumcision not made with hands in putting off the sins of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ" This circumcision has freed us from serving sin on all levels, but this understanding takes a life time to learn, for it to become a reality to God's saints. Remember truth has never set anyone free, it is not until we know it that it sets us free.
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There are two natures in the universe. Everyone in the world has one of two natures:
1. The Sin Nature of Satan.
2. The Divine Nature of God. Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. 2 Peter 1:4
That's it. You can't mix and match. It's one or the other.
It has nothing to do with the soul and your desires. It is NATURE. Someone can still be in the Adamic state with a sin nature (unsaved) and have good desires but they will still be on their way to hell unless they are born again of Christ's nature.
For a born again son of God, the power of sin has been destroyed in the flesh. Sin has no more power over us. Christ set us free.
Yes. This body will go back to the dust. We are awaiting our new bodies. Meanwhile we can no longer blame this body when we sin because Christ took away the power of sin for us. When we sin it is because we choose to sin, dishonor the Lord and defile the temple.
Bottomline:
We can no longer blame this body for sin. When we sin, we sin by choice. The soul usurps authority over Christ and His Spirit. It is the soul that will stand before the Lord and is accountable for the deeds done in this flesh. The body goes back to the dust. God can demand that we keep His temple holy because He has sanctified it through circumcision by the Spirit. Crucified are all of its affections and lusts. There are no motions of sin working in its members. It is circumcised by the removal of the spirit of iniquity that was able to work in the children of disobedience. And the law of the Spirit of Life has made it free from the law of sin and death.
1 John 3:8-9 8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
The body is circumcised, sanctified and made the temple of God. The flesh is the dwelling place of Almighty God. How can we even suggest that satan also lives in the same body. In order for us to have a dual nature then this has to be the case. It is time to dispel the myth. We are partakers of the Divine nature, simply by the mere fact that God lives in us. And because the seed remains in the flesh, or body, there is no way it will sin on its own. We must carry it into sin.
We can no longer blame this body for sin. When we sin, we sin by choice. The soul usurps authority over Christ and His Spirit. It is the soul that will stand before the Lord and is accountable for the deeds done in this flesh. The body goes back to the dust. God can demand that we keep His temple holy because He has sanctified it through circumcision by the Spirit. Crucified are all of its affections and lusts. There are no motions of sin working in its members. It is circumcised by the removal of the spirit of iniquity that was able to work in the children of disobedience. And the law of the Spirit of Life has made it free from the law of sin and death.
1 John 3:8-9 8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
The body is circumcised, sanctified and made the temple of God. The flesh is the dwelling place of Almighty God. How can we even suggest that satan also lives in the same body. In order for us to have a dual nature then this has to be the case. It is time to dispel the myth. We are partakers of the Divine nature, simply by the mere fact that God lives in us. And because the seed remains in the flesh, or body, there is no way it will sin on its own. We must carry it into sin.
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Well, it seems to me that everyone here is basically saying: "I am sometimes tempted, and that temptation comes from me, and I must choose whether or not I will deny that temptation, and in order to deny it I must submit to the Spirit, who lives in me but is not me."
The conflict is simply over whether the first me is called "my flesh's desires" or "my soul's desires," which for practical purposes, is completely irrelevant. In the context of this particular discussion, I'm just going to call it simply "me," in the spirit of James 1:14.
Lust is the right word. For it is stronger than 'desire'
It is perfectly normal to be VERY hungry after not eating for 40 days .
ALL temptations are in whatever form they take are to ensnare you to act in the flesh and let the flesh rule and not the Holy Spirit .
In this case the hunger was not a sin. But a weakness in the flesh that demanded to be fed!
The temptation was to use a legitimate hunger to rule and over rule a spiritual principle namely to turn the stones into bread to meet that hunger .
His answer was "man shall not live by bread alone but by every Word that proceedeth form the mouth of God"
Some research into the first expression of that scripture relating to the children of Israel and their fall in the wilderness and also of the first Adam and Eve who fell at the same hurdle .
For man shall not LIVE by every tree that was good to eat . BUt by that Word of God that came forth from His mouth as to what was good and what was evil to eat .and by that word they LIVED .
It was the rejection of that word as to what was good and what was evil and the doing of the serpents will and suggestion that they died.
in Christ
gerald
Going back to Jesus's Baptism, we find the heavens open and a voice saying "This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased"
This was just prier to Jesus being led into the desert to be tempted. As we all know when the Word of God is sown, Satan comes to steal that Word that was sown. Jesus did not need to turn rocks into bread to proof who he was as he already had the Word of God come from the mouth of his Father at his baptism telling him he was his Son.
"man shall not live by bread alone but by every Word that proceedeth form the mouth of God"
Jesus's desire from hunger was only a way for Satan to try to "beguile, entice" Jesus to sin, knowing he had to be very weak having not eaten in 40 days.
"Every man is tempted when he is drawn away of his own lust (desire) and in enticed..."
Anytime we satisfy the flesh over the spiritual we loose.
Paul did a wonderful job of teaching salvation by using the Jewish law of marriage.
Romans 7:1-6 1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth? (The church at Rome had a lot of Jews in it, who had converted from Judaism to Christianity. ) 2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
Just as that woman is bound to her husband as long as her husband lives; so are we bound to our flesh, as long as it is alive. But the body is under the same captivity as the soul. The spirit of iniquity lives in it; but more than that, it initiated the law of sin in our members. Therefore, we were bound to a body of sin and death. 3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man. 4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
Romans 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 1 Corinthians 12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. The body is no longer a body of sins, but it is now the Body of Christ. For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones Ephesians 5:30.
The body of Christ is not some church building. The Word of God says we are members of His Body - His flesh and His bones. He is walking in His Body. He created the New Man in order to walk this earth and do the greater works. Jesus was the first of many brethren. Let your eyes begin to be opened to the Mystery of Godliness.
Romans 7:1-6 1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth? (The church at Rome had a lot of Jews in it, who had converted from Judaism to Christianity. ) 2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
Just as that woman is bound to her husband as long as her husband lives; so are we bound to our flesh, as long as it is alive. But the body is under the same captivity as the soul. The spirit of iniquity lives in it; but more than that, it initiated the law of sin in our members. Therefore, we were bound to a body of sin and death. 3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man. 4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
Romans 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 1 Corinthians 12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. The body is no longer a body of sins, but it is now the Body of Christ. For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones Ephesians 5:30.
The body of Christ is not some church building. The Word of God says we are members of His Body - His flesh and His bones. He is walking in His Body. He created the New Man in order to walk this earth and do the greater works. Jesus was the first of many brethren. Let your eyes begin to be opened to the Mystery of Godliness.
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I am in them, and you are in Me. May they be completely one, so that the world may know that You sent Me and that You have loved them as you loved Me. John 17:23
Colossians 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
Colossians 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
No I am not saying that. They are not the same.
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