Is Ice-cream Good Or Bad? Or Any Form Of Snacks?

Brian Kurkjian said:
I don't know if I would so much call this a 'problem' as I would call it 'death' :confused:
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Oh not death. I have seen people imbibe that much caffeine.

I have seen people down ten pots of coffee a day, we are talking ten cup pots. And still drink colas and knock back from caffeine pills and still walk around. At that point they are anxious, easily angered and not thinking clearly though. And that to me is being defiled.
 
Dave Lucas said:
Here is my way of determining if it is sinful. Because The king said that which goes into a man does not defile him, but what comes from his wicked heart does.

So is the steak addictive?
Do you need steak everyday? Not want, NEED.
Is there a dependency on steak?
Will steak take you away from family, friends and ruin you financially?

If you say no to any or all of these, then steak is NOT going to defile you.
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I get what you're saying but could be confusing to some. I can answer 'no' to the first question and 'yes' to the rest and will still indeed defile you.
 
LysanderShapiro said:
I absolutely agree with you. Though would you call those excesses a sin because it's unhealthy or a sin because it is a dependency that divorces one's energy from God to something else--call it an idol.
And now I'm trying to figure our how smoking itself follows as being a sin, set apart from dependency and excess. Not all who smoke are dependent or do it in excess. I don't, but it's really a choice of health more than a choice of abstaining from sin.
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My step parents were avid smokers.

I see it this way. When you wake and the very first thing you do is light up.
When no cup of coffee is complete without a ciggy.
When no meal is complete unless there is a smoke after it.

You have an addiction. You could only smoke four cigarettes a day, but when you MUST without FAIL need those things to make it through the day. You are addicted and you are defiled, Because you place the power of God in a backseat to a drug.
 
Dave Lucas said:
Oh not death. I have seen people imbibe that much caffeine.

I have seen people down ten pots of coffee a day, we are talking ten cup pots. And still drink colas and knock back from caffeine pills and still walk around. At that point they are anxious, easily angered and not thinking clearly though. And that to me is being defiled.
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That's crazy. Yeah, that to me would mean being defiled as well. At that point, it seems that person wants an escape from life and is using means aside from praying or leaning against the Lord for help.
 
Brian Kurkjian said:
I get what you're saying but could be confusing to some. I can answer 'no' to the first question and 'yes' to the rest and will still indeed defile you.
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The big word in the second sentence is NEED.

Do you really NEED steak every single day?

Would you day turn to crap if you did not have steak?
Would you be less of a person without steak?
Would you not be able to function comfortably without steak?

I have never heard ANYONE need steak that much.

But I have heard all of those excuses for drugs, gambling, sex and other addictions.

Even running can be a defilement if all you seek is those endorphins.
 
Dave Lucas said:
My step parents were avid smokers.

I see it this way. When you wake and the very first thing you do is light up.
When no cup of coffee is complete without a ciggy.
When no meal is complete unless there is a smoke after it.

You have an addiction. You could only smoke four cigarettes a day, but when you MUST without FAIL need those things to make it through the day. You are addicted and you are defiled, Because you place the power of God in a backseat to a drug.
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Are we talking about addiction now or are we talking about smoking?
 
An Orthodox Elder I know put it very well "Enjoy your habit, just make sure you have the habit and it does not have you."

I used to smoke. It was BY FAR, the most enjoyable bad habit imaginable. If it hadn't been slowly killing me I'd still be smoking.
The problem is (aside from crudding up your lungs) that unless you severely limit the habit you will become an addict.
 
LysanderShapiro said:
Are we talking about addiction now or are we talking about smoking?
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I'm talking about smoking. You can just have four of them a day and most would say you're not a smoker really. But if YOU MUST have them, then you're addicted, even on four of them.

Even if you MUST have one, you're addicted. NOTHING should be a MUST have when it comes to something we put into ourselves.

There is a deeper issue when you MUST have something to put into yourself. Any OCD issue is defilement. It needs to be addressed.
 
Dave Lucas said:
I'm talking about smoking. You can just have four of them a day and most would say you're not a smoker really. But if YOU MUST have them, then you're addicted, even on four of them.

Even if you MUST have one, you're addicted. NOTHING should be a MUST have when it comes to something we put into ourselves.

There is a deeper issue when you MUST have something to put into yourself. Any OCD issue is defilement. It needs to be addressed.
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It sounds like you're talking about addiction to smoking, not just the act of smoking itself.
 
Dave Lucas said:
Nicotine is a drug.
You use drugs when you are sick.
You smoke just to smoke you are abusing what the drug was there for.

Yes it is an addiction. You cannot eat your cake and have it too.
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Wait...I think I should have asked something else.

Is it possible to have a smoke and not be addicted?
 
LysanderShapiro said:
Before we do, I asked a question; Is it possible to have a smoke and not be addicted to it?
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Do you smoke other things and inhale it? Or just nicotine based smoke?

If you can find inhaling the smoke from a lit candle and be just as satisfied as with a cigarette than yes you can smoke without addiction.

BUT if you must use a smoke that is laced with a drug, you are fooling yourself if you do not think you have some addiction.
 
Dave Lucas said:
Do you smoke other things and inhale it? Or just nicotine based smoke?

If you can find inhaling the smoke from a lit candle and be just as satisfied as with a cigarette than yes you can smoke without addiction.

BUT if you must use a smoke that is laced with a drug, you are fooling yourself if you do not think you have some addiction.
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Let's start with one thing at a time -- otherwise it'll get to complicated.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying it is impossible to smoke something like a cigarette or a cigar or a pipe or hasheesh and not become addicted. Is that right? Once you smoke any of these, you're hooked--no ifs, ands, or buts about it.
 
LysanderShapiro said:
Let's start with one thing at a time -- otherwise it'll get to complicated.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying it is impossible to smoke something like a cigarette or a cigar or a pipe or hasheesh and not become addicted. Is that right? Once you smoke any of these, you're hooked--no ifs, ands, or buts about it.
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The drug in the smoke IS the addictive substance. The answer is yes.

If all you wanted was smoke inhalation, then a quick grilling with a charcoal grill would be enough.

Instead what you brain craves is the drug, administered by means smoke.

Same as booze. Even one or two beers or glasses of wine will give your brain that drug.
If you drink it everyday without fail, you are addicted.

It may be a mild addiction, but it is using a drug and you are addicted.

When you can stop all together and not desire it any more, then you are NOT actively addicted.
 
Dave Lucas said:
The drug in the smoke IS the addictive substance. The answer is yes.

If all you wanted was smoke inhalation, then a quick grilling with a charcoal grill would be enough.

Instead what you brain craves is the drug, administered by means smoke.

Same as booze. Even one or two beers or glasses of wine will give your brain that drug.
If you drink it everyday without fail, you are addicted.

It may be a mild addiction, but it is using a drug and you are addicted.

When you can stop all together and not desire it any more, then you are NOT actively addicted.
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So it is possible to have a smoke and not be addicted then, yes? In other words, one could have a smoke maybe once a year or once every two years and no time between that is addicted to it.
 
Dave Lucas said:
Then we must examine WHY people smoke.
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Most start due to peer pressure or exposure to the habit from family members.
They continue because it is a VERY ENJOYABLE habit. It both perks you up and makes you feel calm.
If it wasn't slowly killing you it would be the greatest discovery since cooked meat.
 
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