More Study Questions :)

Nov 23, 2013
2,072
312
83
NOTE THE CHRONOLOGY .. (verse numbers)

Num 13:33 "There also we saw the Nephilim the sons of Anak are part of the Nephilim; and we became like grasshoppers in our own sight, and so we were in their sight."
Jos 15:13 Now he gave to Caleb the son of Jephunneh a portion among the sons of Judah, according to the command of the LORD to Joshua, namely, Kiriath-arba, Arba being the father of Anak that is, Hebron.

Jos 15:14 Caleb drove out from there the three sons of Anak: Sheshai and Ahiman and Talmai, the children of Anak.

SO CALEB DROVE OUT THE SONS OF ANAK WHOM WERE NEPHILIM ..
 
Sep 3, 2009
12,154
4,730
113
Florida
#7

The evil one must wait for revelation before acting. Gen 3 revealed that the seed of the woman would crush his head thus he had his fallen ones enter humanity to corrupt the seed of Eve. This is what brought on the flood judgment.
Now we have had this discussion about 100 times over the past few hears.

So then, for your opinion to be truth, it is up to you to show the Scriptures which support your comment.

The problem now for you is that there are NO Scriptures to support it!!!!

Everything you can and will post will not say one word about fallen angels having sex with humans.

It is not there!!!! You want it to be there so you will say this and that but the truth is, It is not there.

Genesis 6:2
"When man began to multiply on the face of the land and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of God saw that the daughters of man were attractive. And they took as their wives any they chose. 3 Then the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not abide in man forever, for he is flesh: his days shall be 120 years.” 4 There were giants on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men who were of old, the men of renown.
5 The Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intention of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually."

"Sons of God" is in Hebrew bene elohim. That refers to the human Godly line of Seth. The Hebrew "Son of" is an IDIOM which means to "bear the character of something or someone. It is therefore impossible for a fallen angel or demon to be in view as they can not exhibit the character of God in any way what so ever.

That my friend is the grammatical truth and it can not be changed or altered. It is what it is!

"Daughters of men" is in Hebrew exactly what it says.......Daughters of MEN. Female children of humans.

Giants in the Hebrew is the word "Nephilim" from hence comes the dispute. But when study is done on this we see that this word means PRINCES,WARRIORS, also.....in Arabic, means ....".born into royal houses.......men with a reputation. "

Not one word about demons or devils.
 
Jul 17, 2013
452
75
28
Anak was not from a line of Nephilim the ten spies that brought the wilderness wandering judgment lied about that.

The ancient mythologies obviously worshipped half man half god beings which they made up from the false accounts of the Gen 6 experience related over the centuries by idol worshipping lost men like nimrod.

You've built your case on the false witness of the ten spies who died in the wilderness unlike Caleb and Joshua who went into the promise land. I can see how you could believe the way that you do but I am not going to believe those ten spies who lied because the bible says the Nephilim brought upon the world the judgment of the flood and that race of beings was destroyed. The idea of one of Noah's children carrying the genes of the Nephilim is mere guesswork is it not?

We have alive today giant men in the NBA I'm 6' tall but am dwarfed next to them, Goliath was just like them and nothing more. There is a reason behind the Zeus Hercules Horus Osiris mythologies. They were derived from when the sons of God married the daughters of man. These perversions of what took place in gen were scattered at the Tower of Babel which is why in the Greek, Roman and Babylonian mythologies we have the same gods with different names.
 
Sep 3, 2009
12,154
4,730
113
Florida
huh ???
the seed of the woman (Israel) is Jesus ..
you will find a continuation of this prophecy here .. Rev 12:1-6
note: the 12 stars on the head of "the woman (Israel) are her 12 tribes .. as you see, "her "seed" is Jesus ..

this was a prophecy by God of the coming redemption because of what satan did .. in other words, God was telling satan he did not win, but will lose ..
Not so!

The scene which John is shown next is an extension of what has preceded. In the previous chapter, where John has shown two witnesses who prophesied and tormented the whole world and were eventually killed in Jerusalem. The character of their ministry is that of Jewish Old Test prophets, and their connection with Jerusalem tells us that they are Jews, converted and preaching Jesus..

It is clear that one of their ministries is to act as witnesses in a way which is especially effective at reaching unbelieving Jews and so contribute toward the spiritual restoration of Israel prophesied elsewhere in Scripture (Jer. Jer. 31:34-37; Eze. Eze. 37:1; Rom. 11:25-27).

Now, the scene shifts to a series of signs which depict a woman struggling against her adversary, the dragon. This too is a Jewish scene, but with aspects which range all the way back to man’s Fall in the Garden of Eden and the subsequent promise of a redeemer. The signs which John sees in heaven portray events which have happened and will happen on the earth.

Revelation 12:1-6.......(ESV)
"And a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars. 2 She was pregnant and was crying out in birth pains and the agony of giving birth. 3 And another sign appeared in heaven: behold, a great red dragon, with seven heads and ten horns, and on his heads seven diadems. 4 His tail swept down a third of the stars of heaven and cast them to the earth. And the dragon stood before the woman who was about to give birth, so that when she bore her child he might devour it. 5 She gave birth to a male child, one who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron, but her child was caught up to God and to his throne, 6 and the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, in which she is to be nourished for 1,260 days.

"The great wonder in heaven" is something pointing to a definite object. The WOMAN, is actually on earth but the wonder or sign is seen in heaven, so that the purpose of God maybe known from heaven.

The WOMAN here is the nation of Israel. When the Revelation is actually studied it will show that the book pictures FOUR women, all of them in a represenitive capacity. Israel is seen not as she has been or is now but as she will be. It is the nation as God had intended her to be, a condition that will be fulfilled in the reign of the Messiah when the CHILD who is Christ was born.

If that is not enough to convince us that the WOMAN is Israel then read verse 5 again. The MAN CHILD who is Christ comes from the woman. It therefore is impossible for the woman to be Jesus.The man child is to rule all nations with a rod of iron. He is without question the Lord Jesus Christ.
 
#1: Explain situating of Naphtali's placement in reference to Deuteronomy 33:23?


Yes, you are in error…this section was prophecy over each of the tribes not geographical distribution of land as per each tribe. However as we learn from the Targumim (ancient Jewish Rabbis) he will have possession to the west of the sea of Genesareth (the sea of Galilee in the north), and to the south (of it). If you look at a map you will see this is literally the case (save that which went to Issachar on the southern-most tip


#2: Where were the firstfruits offered? Only at the Temple or in towns too? (Deuteronomy 26:1-10, Leviticus 23:9-14.)


At the Tabernacle which in earliest times was in Shiloh but could be moved as the Lord commanded. Shiloh was sort of the capital at that time and was located in what later became known as Ephraim (the Kingdom of Israel in the north) just north of Jacob’s Beth-El south of Jordan in what we now call the West Bank.


#3: Where are the (faithful) deceased Israelites now (spiritually)?


They were awaiting God’s promised redeemer (Messiah) and after the crucifixion, Christ entered Sheol and rescued them, setting them free, and they are with Him (along with all the saved among us) in heaven until the parousia.


#4: Thoughts on translations- Vulgate vs. Masoretic, & origins?


The Vulgate unlike the Byzantine-Greek majority texts is based not on the LXX but the best (and most accepted) Hebrew Manuscripts during Jerome’s time. The Vulgate being interpreted into Latin however takes liberties unknown to western thinkers that would not have been part of the mindset of the earlier Hebrews and so led to a limited number of errors made obvious when read today in light of the LXX, Targums, and Dead Sea Scroll versions (for example see Genesis 3:15 in the Vulgate). But aside from this it is a descent OT translation…

The Masoretic comes to us 9 centuries after the Christ events, and IMO changes and interpretational differences (I have not counted these inferences but there are over 20) occurred in light of that. In other words, IMO the Masoretes intentionally used alternative renderings (not indicated in the Targums or Dead Sea Scroll versions) to the meaning implied in the LXX because they indicated our Messiah too obviously. It was a good translation however (with the exception of this possible motive, as I do not know for sure but it is curious) taken mostly from a few earlier copies of texts still extant, the Talmud, early prayer books, etc. Now also note there are differences between the pre-JPS Masoretic and the JPS Masoretic were even more liberal selections of word choice or alternate meaning have been instilled (IMO to the detriment of the Text…but the excuse I have been given is “You do not read it in the original tongue, therefore you do not realize the possibility of these renderings…but I ask, why come to so different a conclusion to the Targumim of the 1st and 2nd century in these places…like in Isaiah 7:14 the LXX Rabbis from 300 years before Christ, and the Targumim understand the use of Almah, or maiden, to mean “virgin” because of the Prophet’s use of Bethulah in reference to principalities, cities, towns etc. They understood that a “maiden” in Israel was always assumed to be a virgin, to falsely accuse otherwise was false witness and subject to severe punishment or even death…so for the later Masoretes to render this “young woman” and not even at least young UNMARRIED or never married woman IMO is an insult to the text.


#5: Because the honey Samson ate from the lion's carcass considered an unclean food, what were the repercussions if his actions? Why did the Lord remain with him?


What makes you think it was an unclean food (…for the bees to have built a hive there we are talking about a well-aged dried up old skull)?


#6: Ruth was a Moabite, who were not allowed to enter the congregation even till the tenth generation. Did this not include proselytes? Deuteronomy 23.


Well first off Ruth was of a generation beyond the 10th generation after the Exodus so this does not apply here at all, but also when a person entered the covenant of Israel they were fully accepted and t o be treated as family, the true Israel being the Israel of the Spirit not the flesh. A ger tzedek or righteous gentile convert was fully accepted immediately after conversion and baptism (the tivellah service, or washing, in a sanctified mikvah or pool was a God ordained method of consecration of all people and things being “set apart” or made Holy by Him for His purpose or use…even down to the smallest instrument for the Tabernacle or Temple) if a male then they also had to be circumcised.


#7: Thoughts on Nephilim? (Gensis 6:1-4) Giant Caananite ancestors?


Read the former threads for much valuable information regarding the use of the term (literally in Genesis 6 and later figuratively by the lying spies)…nothing indicates these were the Canaanites ancestors…see the discussions of the three views (offspring of fallen ones or manifest angels with human females, the sons of Seth theory, and the Magistrate-Kings theory)


#8: Is 1 Samuel 2:35 speaking of priests or Jesus?


I admit there are differing views on this one but for me the clue is that this faithful priest (or these faithful priests) will follow His anointed (not are His anointed one) and for me this prophecy speaks of David’s Zadok (see Ezekiel 44 but also go through Strong’s for a more complete picture)


#9: Is the 'boiling' spoken of in 1 Samuel 2 against or not in line with God's law? I thought He already told them what part they would receive.


The boiling spoken of in your translation is the word baschal and can also mean baking, sizzling, and more but I see no sense in what you are asking here…I cannot see how you think this would be with or against the Torah (law as you put it).


#10: What of (Numbers 21:14) Book of Wars & (Joshua 10:13) the Book of Jasher?



We know obviously that other books or writings existed in the time of the Israelites (even from before the Exodus) which were books of history and much more. These two books either no longer exist or else have not been found but this does not necessitate that they did not exist at this time.


#11: (Joshua 10) Were there two kings if Hebron, then?


Hehom…name the other?


#12: (Genesis 49:10) Why do some translations say Shiloh?


Some? The word is Shiloh and it speaks to the one (a future person) who would come when Judah lost its scepter and the gentiles would flow unto Him and His “Shabbat” would be glorious…it is speaking of the Messiah (Y’shua/Jesus specifically)…if you PM me with your e-mail address I will send you a more complete essay which addresses this very topic…


#13: (1 Samuel 2:30) Was the Levite promise conditional?


Not really, faithful, spiritual, Israel walked before Him always. Physical often idolatrous grace abusing Israel were only His children is one sense but not the other actual sense of their being of His Spirit but that was always their choice. This same truth applies to each of the tribes not just the Levites (Deuteronomy 28 – read it) and in a sense applies to all who call themselves followers of Y’shua/Jesus today…mere profession or taking a bath does not make a child of God…believing God (not just “in God”) like father Abraham, is what God counts as righteous before Him and such a one will receive the One (the Holy One of Israel) that He has sent (and accept the work He came to do on their behalf and be saved)
 
Nov 23, 2013
2,072
312
83
Anak was not from a line of Nephilim the ten spies that brought the wilderness wandering judgment lied about that.
scripture says you are wrong ..

Num 13:33 "There also we saw the Nephilim the sons of Anak are part of the Nephilim; and we became like grasshoppers in our own sight, and so we were in their sight."

as is said in Hebrew .. yada yada yada .. which equates to blah blah blah ..

perhaps you would do well if you did not depend on your own reasoning ..
 
Last edited:
Nov 23, 2013
2,072
312
83
Giants in the Hebrew is the word "Nephilim" from hence comes the dispute. But when study is done on this we see that this word means PRINCES,WARRIORS, also.....in Arabic, means ....".born into royal houses.......men with a reputation. "
actually I can tell you do not speak Hebrew ..
Nephil or more correctly transliterated "nephiyl" basically means "that which is rejected" .. the "im" is the plural suffix .. it means "a liar" derived from naphal .. so the original who's name was Nephil was a liar .. and lied against God ..
 
Nov 23, 2013
2,072
312
83
I find it funny you go to the Arabic, who did not even have an alphabet before Jesus was born, and contradict the bible and say Jinn built the Temple of Solomon .. LOL
 
Nov 23, 2013
2,072
312
83
The Masoretic comes to us 9 centuries after the Christ events, and IMO changes and interpretational differences (I have not counted these inferences but there are over 20) occurred in light of that. In other words, IMO the Masoretes intentionally used alternative renderings (not indicated in the Targums or Dead Sea Scroll versions) to the meaning implied in the LXX because they indicated our Messiah too obviously.
this is truth .. indeed, they do not alter scripture but rater purposely confound it ..

like Paul using the OT to convert Jews (Herod & Festus for example) .. that made them guilty of crucifying God .. but they still don't get it, that was why He came ..

notice Bernrice (queen of the Jews, sister of Herod Agrippa II and lover to Agrippa II & Titus son of Emperor Titus was there too) Act 25:23 ..

which dates the texts ..
 
Last edited:
Nov 23, 2013
2,072
312
83
which dates the texts ..
52 AD Marcus Antonius Felix appointed Roman Prefect/Governor of Judea
61 AD Porcius Festus appointed Roman Prefect/Governor of Judea
62 AD Albinus appointed Roman Prefect/Governor of Judea
 
Jul 17, 2013
452
75
28
scripture says you are wrong ..

Num 13:33 "There also we saw the Nephilim the sons of Anak are part of the Nephilim; and we became like grasshoppers in our own sight, and so we were in their sight."

as is said in Hebrew .. yada yada yada .. which equates to blah blah blah ..

perhaps you would do well if you did not depend on your own reasoning ..
Key evidence? "We saw"

Not said by the two believers in the group - josh and Caleb

No where in scripture does it say that angels cannot procreate. You admitted that. Now your using the report of ten unbelievers to build your case "we saw"

I don't accept that. But don't worry it's not a fighting matter, I still love you brother. If I'm wrong it would not be a surprise to anyone. But I've been taught and this was my answer.
 
Nov 23, 2013
2,072
312
83
Key evidence? "We saw"
Not said by the two believers in the group - josh and Caleb
Now your using the report of ten unbelievers to build your case "we saw"
yes .. they SAW them ..
and Caleb drove them out ..
HOW could Caleb have "drove them out" if it was a lie ???

what is so difficult here ???

Jos 15:14 Caleb drove out from there the three sons of Anak: Sheshai and Ahiman and Talmai, the children of Anak.

Num 13:33 "There also we saw the Nephilim the sons of Anak are part of the Nephilim; and we became like grasshoppers in our own sight, and so we were in their sight."

an analogy is not a lie ..
 
Sep 3, 2009
12,154
4,730
113
Florida
Key evidence? "We saw"

Not said by the two believers in the group - josh and Caleb

No where in scripture does it say that angels cannot procreate. You admitted that. Now your using the report of ten unbelievers to build your case "we saw"

I don't accept that. But don't worry it's not a fighting matter, I still love you brother. If I'm wrong it would not be a surprise to anyone. But I've been taught and this was my answer.
Matthew 22:29-30
"But Jesus answered and said to them, "You are mistaken, not understanding the Scriptures nor the power of God. "For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven. "But regarding the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was spoken to you by God:…
 
Sep 3, 2009
12,154
4,730
113
Florida
actually I can tell you do not speak Hebrew ..
Nephil or more correctly transliterated "nephiyl" basically means "that which is rejected" .. the "im" is the plural suffix .. it means "a liar" derived from naphal .. so the original who's name was Nephil was a liar .. and lied against God ..
You would be correct. I do not speak Hebrew and neither do you but I never said I did. Google is my friend just as it is yours.
 
Sep 3, 2009
12,154
4,730
113
Florida
yes .. they SAW them ..
and Caleb drove them out ..
HOW could Caleb have "drove them out" if it was a lie ???

what is so difficult here ???

Jos 15:14 Caleb drove out from there the three sons of Anak: Sheshai and Ahiman and Talmai, the children of Anak.

Num 13:33 "There also we saw the Nephilim the sons of Anak are part of the Nephilim; and we became like grasshoppers in our own sight, and so we were in their sight."

an analogy is not a lie ..
Agreed. They were obviousely there and were driven out.

I am wondering however if "Into joy" was meaning that there size was LIED about or exaggerated by those 10 spies?

Being in a strange land, alone......fear can cause mind games on the individual.
 
Nov 23, 2013
2,072
312
83
Matthew 22:29-30
"But Jesus answered and said to them, "You are mistaken, not understanding the Scriptures nor the power of God. "For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven. "But regarding the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was spoken to you by God:…
that would be correct ..
Paul explains "spiritual bodies" here .. 1Cr 15:36-50