Question on Christmas being Pagan?

Major said:
I am not going so far as to say that the tree thing is a sin.

The Bible makes it clear that created objects, in and of themselves, such as Christmas trees, have no secret demonic spiritual power, residing in their needles and branches.

All I am saying is that the practice TO ME is the same as trick or treat on Halloween. They are products of Pagan worship practices and IMO should be ignored. But that is just me.

Now before someone says that Halloween came from the church so it is Christian........it was In 998, St. Odilo, the CATHOLIC abbot of the powerful monastery of Cluny in Southern France, added a celebration on Nov. 2. This was a day of prayer for the souls of all the faithful departed. This feast, called All Souls Day, spread from France to the rest of Europe.

So now the Church had feasts for all those in heaven and all those in purgatory?
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Think we agree not the best thing to have a tree, but also not something to have a church split over!
 
my 2 cents you can make Christmas pagan with or without a tree. .its all in how we want to make it.one thing for sure Christmas has been commercialized to the point of its all about money. .i was at a store that had Christmas decorations out with Halloween costumes . i remember Christmas at home then family dinners .if it bothers one to put up a tree then dont do it..

its a shame we dont return to Christmas plays at church church caroling .visiting the nursing homes .take the children to see the gma gpas .watch eyes sparkle
 
YeshuaFan said:
Think we agree not the best thing to have a tree, but also not something to have a church split over!
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I agree.

However, if and when the reason why a church should not have a Christmas tree is explained in a Biblical and common sense way and some of the people become angry over that......then that is an indication of a deeper theological problem.

You see.....we as Christians can love nature and tress and grass and rivers and I do. However when we begin to "substitute" nature in place of the ONE who created nature then we have fallen for the trap of religion over Christ and when we then begin to hug tree and kiss frogs we have created an IDOL we worship.

I realize how subtle that is but it is nonetheless the picture.
 
Major said:
I agree.

However, if and when the reason why a church should not have a Christmas tree is explained in a Biblical and common sense way and some of the people become angry over that......then that is an indication of a deeper theological problem.

You see.....we as Christians can love nature and tress and grass and rivers and I do. However when we begin to "substitute" nature in place of the ONE who created nature then we have fallen for the trap of religion over Christ and when we then begin to hug tree and kiss frogs we have created an IDOL we worship.

I realize how subtle that is but it is nonetheless the picture.
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This to me is a lot like type of music in worship, as people have individual convictions, and should not be calling out pastors and elders on it!
 
Lanolin said:
But then who do the unicorns belong to?
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Hello Lanolin;

The unicorns go back centuries originating from mythologies from Greek to China and around the world. Mythologies are made up by people.

I personally have never run into a horse with a horn on it's head or a deer that flies, thus both are myths.

Science tried to prove mermaids exist which habitate in the ocean, another myth. So no way are they going to appear pure and attractive but dingy with bad breath.
 
YeshuaFan said:
This to me is a lot like type of music in worship, as people have individual convictions, and should not be calling out pastors and elders on it!
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I disagree. Music is a personal choice style.

Whether to speak in tongues or not is a Bible position.

The only reason to speak in tongues is because an individual have failed to be taught or purposefully decided to reject the word of Jesus Christ.

Mark 16:14-18........
"Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen. 15And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. 16He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. 17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; 18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."

Standing in front of Jesus were His 11 disciples/Apostles. To THEM He gave the great commission.

If WE, anyone today was included in those 11, Jesus would have said that to US> He gave THEM the ability to have the SIGN GIFTS in order to validate their teaching as followers and disciples of God.

No one today is or can be an apostle so the idea of miracles, new knowledge, tongues or prophecies does not exist according to the Bible.

That IMO is exactly why Paul said in 1 Corth. 13:8-10.........
"Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away."

When The Bible which was written by those same 11 men was completed it was then the Perfect/Complete word of God.

Then those temporary Sign Gifts were no longer needed.

Today we live by faith believing what God has said!
 
Major said:
I disagree. Music is a personal choice style.

Whether to speak in tongues or not is a Bible position.

The only reason to speak in tongues is because an individual have failed to be taught or purposefully decided to reject the word of Jesus Christ.

Mark 16:14-18........
"Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen. 15And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. 16He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. 17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; 18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."

Standing in front of Jesus were His 11 disciples/Apostles. To THEM He gave the great commission.

If WE, anyone today was included in those 11, Jesus would have said that to US> He gave THEM the ability to have the SIGN GIFTS in order to validate their teaching as followers and disciples of God.

No one today is or can be an apostle so the idea of miracles, new knowledge, tongues or prophecies does not exist according to the Bible.

That IMO is exactly why Paul said in 1 Corth. 13:8-10.........
"Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away."

When The Bible which was written by those same 11 men was completed it was then the Perfect/Complete word of God.

Then those temporary Sign Gifts were no longer needed.

Today we live by faith believing what God has said!
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I was referring to having a christmas tree or not, and do not see any speaking today in real tongues nor sign gifted as Apostles were!
 
Major said:
However, if and when the reason why a church should not have a Christmas tree is explained in a Biblical and common sense way and some of the people become angry over that......then that is an indication of a deeper theological problem.
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well at the Church i pastor we have small 4ft tree decorated .. but in all honesty i would like to see a scripture that says Christmas trees dont belong in Church .
 
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