The 144,000 saved..is it referring to...
- Thread starter autumn oddity
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Yes I watched this one too. This Jewish boy who died [clinically dead] for 15 minutes and had an awesome supernatural revelation
about the end times and yet also a challenge to orthodox Jews that there is more to judgment than the outward keeping of traditions.
I believe in the new trendy Replacement Theory pushed by some pro-Palestinian churches they say that the Jews have lost their
salvation (given over to "Christians") and that they have no entitlement to Judea/Israel.
People are forgetting the irrevocable promises of God to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob...
And also that Jerusalem and Mount Zion belong to our Lord and God, Jesus, not to the god of Ishmael.
He says in his interview that the WAR will start in a few months time. Scary, very scary.
Are we ready. Are we built up in faith and in the Holy Spirit? Are we preaching and witnessing to the lost?
Ya know I was thinking, "Why does the world want Israel?" I don't think it's a religious reason, I don't think it's a revenge call because it's all nations. Then it dawned on me that Saudi Arabia is flooding the market with oil, but what if it's because they're running out!? If Saudi Arabia runs out of oil, the only place left is America at a much higher cost, and Israel! Remember, Gog and Magog are asked if they're invading Israel to take a spoil. What would they want? Oil? Most of Israel's spoils are fruits and vegetables and intellect. Remember wheat is supposed to cost a full day's wage for a handful of grain. Makes you wonder what's coming to cause Gog and Magog (whomever they be) to take Israel's resources.
Gal 1:6 I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel—
Gal 1:7 not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.
Gal 1:8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.
Gal 1:9 As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.
This Jewish boy is saying that by studying the Torah and by doing acts of kindness we can be saved.
Is this the same Gospel Paul preached?
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way.
2Th 2:8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming.
2Th 2:9 The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders,
2Th 2:10 and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.
2Th 2:11 Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false,
2Th 2:12 in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
2Th 2:13 But we ought always to give thanks to God for you, brothers beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the firstfruits to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.
2Th 2:14 To this he called you through our gospel, so that you may obtain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
What is unrighteousness if not disobeying the Lord?
Is pinning our hope of salvation on our own efforts...studying Torah and being kind to others instead of pinning our hope of salvation on Christ Jesus, not disobeying the Lord?
Studying Torah and indeed the whole of God's word is good; being kind to people is also good..
These things can not bring salvation.
These things can not replace obedience to the Gospel of Christ Jesus ....to faith in Jesus as the Son of God.
What meaning or value is there in speaking 'Messiah' unless it is acknowledging Jesus the son of Mary, the Son of God?
We all need to remember that Jesus foretold that there would be many false Messiahs::
Luke 21:8 And he said, "See that you are not led astray. For many will come in my name, saying, 'I am he!' and, 'The time is at hand!' Do not go after them.
Luke 21:9 And when you hear of wars and tumults, do not be terrified, for these things must first take place, but the end will not be at once."
Jesus will certainly come again but that will happen according to His own telling, and according to the plan of His Father.
Gal 1:7 not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.
Gal 1:8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.
Gal 1:9 As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.
This Jewish boy is saying that by studying the Torah and by doing acts of kindness we can be saved.
Is this the same Gospel Paul preached?
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way.
2Th 2:8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming.
2Th 2:9 The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders,
2Th 2:10 and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.
2Th 2:11 Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false,
2Th 2:12 in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
2Th 2:13 But we ought always to give thanks to God for you, brothers beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the firstfruits to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.
2Th 2:14 To this he called you through our gospel, so that you may obtain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
What is unrighteousness if not disobeying the Lord?
Is pinning our hope of salvation on our own efforts...studying Torah and being kind to others instead of pinning our hope of salvation on Christ Jesus, not disobeying the Lord?
Studying Torah and indeed the whole of God's word is good; being kind to people is also good..
These things can not bring salvation.
These things can not replace obedience to the Gospel of Christ Jesus ....to faith in Jesus as the Son of God.
What meaning or value is there in speaking 'Messiah' unless it is acknowledging Jesus the son of Mary, the Son of God?
We all need to remember that Jesus foretold that there would be many false Messiahs::
Luke 21:8 And he said, "See that you are not led astray. For many will come in my name, saying, 'I am he!' and, 'The time is at hand!' Do not go after them.
Luke 21:9 And when you hear of wars and tumults, do not be terrified, for these things must first take place, but the end will not be at once."
Jesus will certainly come again but that will happen according to His own telling, and according to the plan of His Father.
Jesus is indeed the ONLY way, period. The boy is a secular Jew who's parents are suing the synagog for posting the video. Someone who's job it is to detect deception vouches that the little she can see of the boy recounting his story states that the boy is speaking the truth as to the event and what he knows. In other words, he's not lying about what he believes happened to him. So look at it from this boy's point of view. He doesn't go to synagog, he doesn't study the word of God, and he had an experience. Afterwards he goes to the only source he knows of as a Jew on religious matters - to a rabbi. What he said caused a great disruption to the orthodox Jews. He told them flat out what they believe about ritual religious dogma won't get them into heaven. Repentance to God will, and isn't that what the word of God says! "Repent! For the Kingdom of God is at hand!" So do we as Christians reject everything this boy says just because he didn't claim Jesus as the Messiah? No. He doesn't know any better. The rabbi is stuck in his dogma and blindness, yet the kid saw what he saw through his heritage. I'm not going to judge him right or wrong, but for him, a Jew, to recount the Two Witnesses that only appears in the John's Revelation, is amazing to me. To quote the words John the Baptist used is amazing to me. He said just what Paul did - your circumcision is worth nothing without a heart's desire for God. That is the word of God from Genesis to Revelation! People will watch the video as a Jew and see conflicting information from what they believe and reject it. Christians will watch the video and see conflicting information from what they believe and reject it. But the spirit calls all "Come!" And the boy says "Repent and turn to God." That's the true Gospel!
P.S. As to the times, only God knows. John and Paul said all these things were coming quickly. It's been 2000 years. His message to repent and return to God is still the same message. These visits are happening to Muslims all over the world too! And with their increase of occurrences, I believe time is coming to an end.
youtu.be/fDAICrsmTpA
I'm looking at it (or endeavouring to at least) from Scriptures point of view.
I, at no time accused the boy of lying...I am concerned that the experience he has had does not conform to Scripture.
I have no doubt that Satan knows the Scriptures too, and if it did orchestrate a vision of the kind the boy reports, then it would be no surprise that there would be some truth mingled with untruth. There is untruth there if one looks closely and measures everything by the word of God.
Ahh Ha! I have not time to view the whole video yet , but it seems to me that all/most of these experiences involve meeting with Jesus....a far cry from the other videos. Is Jesus being glorified? I hope so, we'll see.
It is another gospel, which is accursed. If it was based on truth it would most definitely lift up and glorify the Lord Jesus Himself! The only One who gives life and redemption! But it doesn't and is why its deception. Only the deceived look upon that vision of this boy as truth..
The true Israel makes up believing Jews, and also as well believing Gentiles grafted in by faith in Christ Jesus. And that by the election of grace! But only the deceived can't see this in scripture, but rather who push the beast (papal romes) "Zionist" theory of dispensationalism pre trib secret rapture. The promise was given to Physical Israel and was fulfilled.. And those there today aren't true physical descendants of Israel, so the land doesn't rightfully belong to them. The Zionist propagate this lie from the mouth of the beast. As well the white supremacist aryan "Israeli" myth. Christ is never lifted up in dispensationalism Zionism. It is carnal and based off a fairytale of deception
Yea. I see Jesus being glorified in that latest video. It is exiting to see evidence of the Holy Spirit in the lives of oppressed people.
What do you add in with your cordial?
Jesus has not abandoned the Jews, nor his promises to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.
Just as Jesus made a new covenant with the 10 tribes of Israel, Jesus will also remain faithful to the two tribes of Judah.
1917 - 1948 - 1967 - 2017 ??
Romans 11:23-26
23 And those also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in. For God is able to graft them in again.
24 For if you were cut out of the natural wild olive tree, and were grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree;
how much more these being according to nature will be grafted into their own olive-tree?
25 For I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, lest you should be wise within yourselves;
that blindness in part has happened to Israel, until the fullness of the nations has comes in. [KJV Gentiles]
26 And so all Israel shall be saved; as it is written, "There shall come out of Zion the Deliverer,
and He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob. [Jacob > Israel = 12 tribes = for salvation is of the Jews/ John 4:22]
Galatians 3:6-9
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham,
saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
yes, I have seen this one also.
Amongst all the rubbish and the unbelievable on You Tube there are gems worth liking.
No, but they have not turned to Christ for salvation.....yet.
Salvation is not the Torah.
John 5:37 And the Father who sent me has himself borne witness about me. His voice you have never heard, his form you have never seen,
John 5:38 and you do not have his word abiding in you, for you do not believe the one whom he has sent.
John 5:39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness about me,
John 5:40 yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life.
Sound familiar?
But lets not squabble, rather pray for our Jewish brothers that in studying the Torah they might find Christ because the scriptures do bare witness about Him.
You indeed have a point
But didn't Paul also say that it could not be said what all is in heaven for us, just like the boy? I don't know if I believe the kid of not, truly time will tell. His event happened on the last blood moon. If nothing happens by January we know it was nothing because he said Pres. Obama would be buried in Israel. I don't see how that would happen, but then I never thought in my lifetime America would turns its back on Israel either. I firmly believe when the prophecies of the end times are fulfilled before our very eyes, we won't believe them. I pray I'll recognize them.The promise to physical Israel about receiving their land was fulfilled. " And the Lord gave unto Israel all the land which He sware to give unto their fathers; and they possessed it, and dwelt therein... There failed not aught of any good thing which the Lord had spoken unto the house of Israel; ALL CAME TO PASS. Joshua 21:43-45. The old covenant were types and shadows of the new. Which the book of Hebrews goes over. And the promises are spiritual blessings in Christ, the SEED by which the promises were made. "For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith... Roman 4:13-16. "For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bond maid, the other by a free woman. But he who was of the bond woman was born after the flesh; but he of the free woman was by promise. Which things are an ALLEGORY: for these are the two covenants; the one from mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar. For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. But Jerusalem which is ABOVE is free, which is the mother of us all.. Galatians 4:22-26. So the type and shadow of the old, is the new heaven and new earth, new Jerusalem, prepared for true Israel, which makes up both Jews and Gentiles in Christ. Revelations 21. This is so clear to the believer. There are other scriptures that prove these promises in Christ comes to the spiritual seed, which is of faith. So as Paul states in Romans 11; "As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes; but as touching the election, they are BELOVED for the fathers sakes.. So when the fullness of the Gentiles come in by faith, and grafted in, along with the believing remnant of Jews, so then ALL Israel shall be saved.. That by the election of grace in Christ and His merits alone. This was the promise to Abraham, that all nations shall be blessed in the promised SEED. The Savior of the world. It is Christ Jesus who will gather His elect and bring judgement at His second coming.. Which this boy in his vision gives no reference to. And doesn't lift up the Lord of glory Himself, Jesus the Christ. So yes I believe dispensationalism is fleshly and carnal and doesn't see that the new covenant is spiritual in Christ. And Zionism pushes this lie of carnality.
I have to disagree in love and with respects. The Scriptures are clear IMO that the 144 K will be male, virgin Jews.
God knows where each and every person is as well as every single Jewish person and He will have no problem calling them out.
"calvin". Could it be that the Great Multitude seen in Rev. 7:9-10 that you mentioned is the result of the witnessing of the 144K to the world during the Tribulation period????
I do believe that they will be Gentiles who had never heard the gospel until they came into contact with one of the 144K.
Rev. 7:9........."Standing before the throne and before the Lamb".
That indicates to me that there will be a great number of people who will come out of the Great Tribulation. and are happy in their salvation. Is it possible that most of them will be martyred and stay faithful to the end???? YES!!!!
Matt. 24:13.......
"But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved".
I must disagree with you with all due respect. IMO "Dispensationalism" is one of if not the best method of understanding the Scriptures and how God has related and dealt with man for all time.
I apologize in advance as I am not trying to put words into your mouth, but maybe you do not understand "Dispensationasm"?
A dispensation is a way of ordering things—an administration, a system, or a management. In theology, a dispensation is the divine administration of a period of time; each dispensation is a divinely appointed age. Dispensationalism is a theological system that recognizes these ages ordained by God to order the affairs of the world. Dispensationalism has two primary distinctives:
1) a consistently literal interpretation of Scripture, especially Bible prophecy, and .....
2) a view of the uniqueness of Israel as separate from the church in God’s program.
Dispensationalists hold to a literal interpretation of the Bible as the best hermeneutic. The literal interpretation gives each word the meaning it would commonly have in everyday usage. Allowances are made for symbols, figures of speech, and types, of course. It is understood that even symbols and figurative sayings have literal meanings behind them. So, for example, when the Bible speaks of “a thousand years” in Revelation 20, dispensationalists interpret it as a literal period of 1,000 years (the dispensation of the Kingdom), since there is no compelling reason to interpret it otherwise.
I would also remind all of us that Hagar's son Ishmael was the illegitimate son of Abram. Hagar and Abram were not married so Ishmael could not inherit anything. Isaac was the Son of Promise and he was the only one to inherit the promise made to Abraham. That promise include the LAND and not heaven. The Christians are promised Heaven and our home is the New City of Jerusalem. The Jews are to inherit the LAND and not Heaven.