"Try the spirits"

It is irreavlant what other "SECTS" believe.

What IS the important thing is what the Bible says !!!!

Think! Take for example Jesus’ words in John 10:30, “I and the Father are one.” When first encountered, this might not seem to be a claim to be God. However, when we look at the Jews’ reaction to His statement, “For a good work we stone thee not; replied the Jews, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.” (John 10:33). Now we see an actual claim. The Jews understood Jesus’ statement to be a claim to be God. In the following verses, Jesus never corrects the Jews by saying, “I did not claim to be God.” That indicates Jesus was truly saying He was God by declaring, “I and the Father are one” (John 10:30).

John 8:58 is another example. Jesus declared, "I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. " Again, in response, the Jews take up stones in an attempt to stone Jesus (John 8:59). Why would the Jews want to stone Jesus if He hadn’t said something they believed to be blasphemous, namely, a claim to be God? John repeatedly tells us of the Lord's connection to "I Am". See John: 4:26, 8:24, 8:28, 8:58,and 13:19. The Apostle Paul tells us that Jesus "..is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist." (Colossians 1:15-17)

John 1:1 says that “the Word was God.” John 1:14 says that “And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us” This clearly indicates that Jesus is God in the flesh. Acts 20:28 tells us, "...Be shepherds of the church of God, which He bought with His own blood." Who bought the church with His own blood? Jesus Christ. Acts 20:28 declares that God purchased the church with His own blood. Therefore, Jesus is God!
To try and grasp the Trinity, first understand that God the Father the Son and Holy Spirit are Spirit, light, awesomeness, power, justice and love -- and He in no way conforms to a human's understanding. Jesus told us God is Spirit. Shine two beams of light on the same spot, and you have the light of one, separate, yet also the same as the others. An example of Jesus' light and the Father's light as the same is at this true Near Death Experience here
Next, try to grasp Jesus' nature as being both totally human and totally God. To help you with this consider these paradoxes by early church father Gregory of Nazianzus (329-390 A.D.). Gregory used these to argue against Arianism.

"He was baptized as a man -- but He remitted sins as God...He was tempted as man, but he conquered as God...He hungered -- but He fed thousands...He was wearied, but He is the rest of them that are weary and heavy-laden. He was heavy with sleep, but He walked lightly over the sea...He pays tribute, but it is out of a fish; yea He is the king of those who demanded it...He prays, but he hears prayer. He weeps, but He causes tears to cease. He asks where Lazarus was laid, for He was man; but He raises Lazarus, for He was God. He is sold, and very cheap, for it is only for thirty pieces of silver; but He redeems the world, and that at a great price, for the price was His blood. As a sheep he is led to the slaughter, but He is the shepherd of Israel, and now of the whole world also...He is bruised and wounded, but He heals every disease and every infirmity. He is lifted up and nailed to the tree, but by the tree of life He restores us. He dies, but he gives life, and by His death He destroys death."

Cyril of Alexandria (376 - 444 AD) says, ‘Indeed, the mystery of Christ runs the risk of being disbelieved precisely because it is so incredibly wonderful. For God was in humanity. He who was above all creation was in our human condition; the invisible one was made visible in the flesh; he who is from the heavens and from on high was in the likeness of earthly things; the immaterial one could be touched; he who is free in his own nature came in the form of a slave; he who blesses all creation became accursed; he who is all righteousness was numbered among the transgressors; life itself came in the appearance of death. All this followed because the body, which tasted death, belonged to no other but to him who is the Son by nature,’ [On the Unity of Christ]
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. 1 Timothy 3:16
Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. Isaiah 7:14 (written: 712 BC (Before Christ)

Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call His name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us. Matthew 1:23

For unto us a Child is born, unto us a son is given; and the government will be upon His shoulder: and his name will be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Isaiah 9:6 (written: 712 BC (Before Christ)

And there came a fear on all: and they glorified God, saying, That a great prophet is risen up among us; and, That God hath visited his people. Luke 7:16

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. John 1:1

because he had not only broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making Himself equal with God. John 5:18
Jesus said:
I and my Father are one. John 10:30

The Jews answered him [Jesus], saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. John 10:33
When many were about to stone Jesus for blasphemy (John 10:30-39), He said to them that said he blasphemed "because I said, I am the Son of God?" (John 10:36).

You call Me Teacher and Lord; and ye say well; for so I Am. John 13:13

But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
And Jesus said, I Am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven. Mark 14:61-62
The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool. Psalm 110:1

he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father? John 14:9
"Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own authority; but the Father who dwells in me does his works." ( /www.jesuscentral.com/ji/life-of-jesus-ancient/biography-of-jesus-christ/who-is-Jesus-by-john/gospel-of-john-14_5-14.php href="http://www.jesuscentral.com/ji/life...o-is-Jesus-by-john/gospel-of-john-14_5-14.php" target=_top>/www.jesuscentral.com/ji/life-of-jesus-ancient/biography-of-jesus-christ/who-is-Jesus-by-john/gospel-of-john-14_5-14.php color=#660000 size=3 face=Arial>John 14:10)

And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. John 17:5

And Thomas answered and said unto him [Jesus], My Lord and my God. John 20:28

...lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. 2 Corinthians 4:4
In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. Colossians 1:14-17

...Who [Jesus], being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: Philippians 2:6

...For in him [Jesus] dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. Colossians 2:9

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. 1 Timothy 3:16

...who [Jesus] is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords; 1 Timothy 6:15

Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high. Hebrews 1:2-3

But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. Hebrews 1:8

Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; Titus 2:13

And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, "KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. Revelation 19:16

I know Muslims and Mormons, Christian Scientists, Jehovah Witnesses, Unitarians, Scientologists, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, Seventh Day Adventists -and many others - will not want to hear this, but the Bible declares that Jesus was the FINAL revelation of God to man (Hebrews 1:1-3). There have been no others.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

God has His "mysterious way" of separating His "chosen few" from the many "called" who have access to His "inspired words." This is by a simple declaration "WHO Jesus Christ is come in the flesh."

From this "simple test," those who passed or hurdled it would now be exempt from Jesus' very sharp rebuke!

* John 8:19 Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.

Quite clearly, knowing the true JESUS would lead to the identity of the FATHER from this rebuke. Thus,

Who is the FATHER?
Who is the One True GOD in the Holy Bible?
 

Ginger

Inactive
So "where is" the "test for spirits" so as to distinguished the "chosen" from the "called?"

I'm sorry, I seem to have misunderstood what you are discussing.

What exactly do you mean by "distinguishing the chosen from the called?"

Do you mean, respectively, the "saved and the unsaved?"
 
I'm sorry, I seem to have misunderstood what you are discussing.

What exactly do you mean by "distinguishing the chosen from the called?"

Do you mean, respectively, the "saved and the unsaved?"

This is only what I knowabout the "chosen" and the "called."

* Matthew 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

* Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

* Matthew 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
 

Ginger

Inactive
So, we're really not talking about "testing spirits", but rather, about discerning who is and isn't saved?

That's a BIG no, no!

What the Bible says about that is:

We are not to judge because we cannot tell the saved from the unsaved by mere appearances and we will be judged by the same measure we give to those we condemn.

And also:

John 13:35 By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another."

matthew 7:16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?

These are the verses we should be examining. What does "love" mean, and what is the "fruit" Jesus is talking about?
 

Ginger

Inactive
The first thing people will want to says is : "Love is kind, love is patient,....." But love also disciplines and corrects, etc...

The "fruit of the Spirit is:

  1. Love
  2. Joy
  3. Peace
  4. Longsuffering
  5. Kindness
  6. Goodness
  7. Faithfulness
  8. Gentleness
  9. Self-control
The "Fruit of the Spirit, carries eternal rewards. It is not referring to temporary acts of love or kindness as we experience here on Earth. But rather that act of kindness we should will actually make a lasting and eternal difference in that person's life.

For, instance, giving a man standing on the corner of a road $5 for food, seems like an act of love, or kindness. But if he runs out and buys a bottle of booze, what was really accomplished? ....aside from the giver feeling good about himself.

That act of "kindness" was not truly compassionate, nor loving, so how can it be kind?
 
Ginger the simple answer is you do not do an act of kindness or compassion to make yourself feel good. The truly kind thing to do with the guy on the corner is to give him the address to a walk in addiction clinic and tell him that God does love him, even though he has fallen.
 

Ginger

Inactive
That's right, seeking.

I had a man flag me down on a city street and tell me he hadn't eaten in three days and could I give him some money for food.

I told him there was a church just four blocks away. If he would go there they would give him vouchers at a local restaurant and possibly some other help.

I asked the church a couple days later if he had come and they said, "no"

If he was really looking to be fed, I think he would have walked for blocks to get free meal tickets. (shrug)

The point being, what we, as humans, often see as loving and kind and good, is usually adding to thew problem or worse - hurts innocent people and plays to the ego of the one we think we are showing compassion.

That's what Isaiah is talking about when he says our good deeds are like filthy rags to the Lord. WE need to distinguish between what makes us "feel" good and what is truly good in the eyes of God.
 
This is only what I knowabout the "chosen" and the "called."

* Matthew 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

* Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

* Matthew 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Many people hear the call of God which comes through His revelation of Himself through two things—the creation and the conscience within us. But only the "few" will respond because they are the ones who are truly hearing. Jesus said many times “He who has ears to hear, let him hear” (Matthew 11:15; Mark 4:9; Luke 8:8, 14:35). The point is that everyone has ears but only a few are listening and responding. Not everyone who hears the gospel receives it but only the "few" who have ears to hear. The "many" hear, but there is no interest or there is outright antagonism toward God. Many are called or invited into the kingdom, but none are able to come on their own. God must draw the hearts of those whom come; otherwise they will not (John 6:44).
 

Ginger

Inactive
Exactly, Major!

Everyone is given the same chance for salvation. It is offerred to all. But very few accept it.

There is only one way. People who try to get to "heaven" by other means are wasting their time.
 
Exactly, Major!

Everyone is given the same chance for salvation. It is offerred to all. But very few accept it.

There is only one way. People who try to get to "heaven" by other means are wasting their time.

Yes, there is only "one way" that God prescribes to follow in order to reach heaven. The only way is the TRUTH, and Jesus said:

* Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Therefore, what is the TRUTH in His "test for spirits" where every professing Christians all "Confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh?"
 

Ginger

Inactive
Yes, there is only "one way" that God prescribes to follow in order to reach heaven. The only way is the TRUTH, and Jesus said:

* Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Therefore, what is the TRUTH in His "test for spirits" where every professing Christians all "Confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh?"

I thought this was answered already...
confused.png


The test for spirits, is a test for spirits.

We can't know who is and who is not saved! Only God knows the heart.

We can watch someone go through the motions and say all the things they think we want to hear and do wonderful acts of charity, but God knows the heart.

But if you insist on a test for human salvation, the Jesus said, "If you deny me before men, I will deny you before my Father."

Still this is not certain for us, because we don't know that God will not change this person's heart at some point in time.

In-other-words, human do not have a test to see who is or isn't saved. It is not our place to make such judgment calls on Earth.

Now, concerning "professing Christians," this we can measure! A Christian is defined by certain criteria. Those who fit that specific criteria are Christian by definition. All true Christians adhere to the same basic and essential doctrines. Anyone who does not fit that criteria is not a Christian by definition- even if they claim they are! Some people are Christian in name - only.

All true Christians believe in the same basic doctrines which are found in the Holy Scriptures and summarized in the Apostle's Creed:
I believe in God, the Father Almighty, the Creator of heaven and earth, Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord: John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son,
Who was conceived of the Holy Spirit, Luk 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
born of the Virgin Mary, Luk 1:27 To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name [was] Mary.
suffered under Pontius Pilate, Luke 23:16 I will therefore chastise him, and release [him].
was crucified, Luk 23:23 And they were instant with loud voices, requiring that he might be crucified. ..24 And Pilate gave sentence that it should be as they required.
died, Luk 23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.
and was buried. Luk 23:52 This [man] went unto Pilate, and begged the body of Jesus. 53 And he took it down, and wrapped it in linen, and laid it in a sepulchre that was hewn in stone, wherein never man before was laid.
He descended into hell. Psa 16:10 For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

And this is not to be interpreted as a "test" for salvation. It is merely the defining doctrines of Christianity.

It you don't believe all of this, you are not a Christian, because this is what being a Christian is all about.
 
Hi Major,
You seem very passionate about your faith, which is good, although I think it also helps (at times) when arguing a certain position to more or less ‘understate’ our own arguments. This is because we all have a natural tendency to over-exaggerate certain arguments that we feel bolster or support our own position. This over-exaggeration can cause people with differing perspectives to disregard our arguments, because they have stumbled over one of our overstatements (often stated out of passion!).


You argue that it is irrelevant what other ‘sects’ believe, saying that all that matters is what is in the Bible. That is an understandable starting point, though it also raises questions such as what Bible version you are talking about, or whether the Bible is infallible (i.e. the infallible ‘Word of God’), or just inspired. But I may save that debate for another place and time.


I fully believe what the Bible says about Jesus and the Father being one. I believe that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh. No disagreements there; I also believe (like I think you do) that it takes more than such a professed belief to make one a Christian.


Finally, you state, Major, that Jesus was the final revelation of God to man, citing Hebrews 1:1-3 as your proof-text. Please read the passage you cited again. The word ‘final’ is not there.


Have a look at the Acts of the Apostles. You will find numerous accounts of Christians receiving revelations from God, after Jesus ascended up to heaven following His resurrection. I believe it is incorrect to state that God no longer gives men revelations (though I agree that we must discard any ‘revelation’ that lies contrary to what Jesus taught).


I’ll leave it there for now.
 
Simple as it seems to be, this "test for spirits" requires divine revelation to apply it. How come it simply states, "Confessing Jesus Christ is come in the flesh" is enough to have passed the test. WHO is Jesus Christ BEFORE coming in the flesh. This is core of the test.

Let us remember it was the Father who made the "testament of salvation" in the Old Testament.
What is the requisite for the fulfillment of the "testament" accordng to Paul in Heb 9:16?
 

Ginger

Inactive
Well, it's obvious I don't have a clue as to what this thread is about.

All I can say is we, as Christians, are not supposed to be quick to believe something just because it sounds reasonable, or because it is accompanied by something seemingly miraculous. We are supposed to prayerfully study the Scriptures to see what God has to say.

I'll leave you with that as if I don't know what you're talking about, I certainly can't add anything of value to the conversation. :)
 
Hi Major,
You seem very passionate about your faith, which is good, although I think it also helps (at times) when arguing a certain position to more or less ‘understate’ our own arguments. This is because we all have a natural tendency to over-exaggerate certain arguments that we feel bolster or support our own position. This over-exaggeration can cause people with differing perspectives to disregard our arguments, because they have stumbled over one of our overstatements (often stated out of passion!).

You argue that it is irrelevant what other ‘sects’ believe, saying that all that matters is what is in the Bible. That is an understandable starting point, though it also raises questions such as what Bible version you are talking about, or whether the Bible is infallible (i.e. the infallible ‘Word of God’), or just inspired. But I may save that debate for another place and time.

I fully believe what the Bible says about Jesus and the Father being one. I believe that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh. No disagreements there; I also believe (like I think you do) that it takes more than such a professed belief to make one a Christian.

Finally, you state, Major, that Jesus was the final revelation of God to man, citing Hebrews 1:1-3 as your proof-text. Please read the passage you cited again. The word ‘final’ is not there.

Have a look at the Acts of the Apostles. You will find numerous accounts of Christians receiving revelations from God, after Jesus ascended up to heaven following His resurrection. I believe it is incorrect to state that God no longer gives men revelations (though I agree that we must discard any ‘revelation’ that lies contrary to what Jesus taught).

I’ll leave it there for now.

Passionate???? I agree with that but I think maybe a better word would be convinced.

My friend, there is no such thing as "neutral" according to the Scripture.

Rev. 3:15......
So then because thou art lukewarm, and are neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth".

IMO, the middle of the road, (Don't make waves) is the worst kind of hypocrisy there is. It is however the position of a great many people today. Personally I must admitt that IMO the reason America has every jail filled, the highest teenage pregnanct rate in THE WORLD, and one of the highest crime rates in the world is because preachers all over the land started to preach sermons to make people feel good instead of preaching the truth of Gods Word.

I appreciate your thoughts but in all honesty, why would I or anyone else seek to "undersate" anything??

Explaining what the Scriptures say is NOT understateing but is simply properly explaining them.

There are all kinds of teaching and opinions inside of the church of Christians. However, there is also a tremendous about of un-leared teaching which is not accountable to anyone except that person.
Main line Christians and by that I mean Methodists, Baptists, Presbyterians etc. are accountable to others in their teachings.

What I state is from the Scriptures and they are the basis for my comments. For that reason I quote the Scriptures for a foundation of truth AND NOT A PRODUCT OF MY OWN MIND.

You said.............
" I also believe (like I think you do) that it takes more than such a professed belief to make one a Christian."

NO, that is not what I believe not because that is me not believing it but the Bible does not substainiate it.
This is not "understating" but is in fact the truth of the Word of God.

Acts 16:30
"And brought them out and said, sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said .........
BELIEVE ON THE LORD JESYS CHRIST, and thou shalt be saved and they house".

Romans 10:9
"That if thou shalt confess with thou mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in theine heart that God raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved".

All that is required for a man to be saved is to believe upon the Lord Jesus plus NOTHING!!!

Then you stated.........................
"Finally, you state, Major, that Jesus was the final revelation of God to man, citing Hebrews 1:1-3 as your proof-text. Please read the passage you cited again. The word ‘final’ is not there. "

What I said my friend was WHAT I SAID not what the Scriptures said. It is obvious that the word FINAL is not in those verses BUT on the other hand, it is exactly what those verses are teacing us through them.

God has revealed Himself through various means is a true statment.
1. Visions. (Isaiah 6)
2. Dreams (Daniel 2).
3. Poetry (Psalms 139)
4. Biography (The Gospels).
5. Sermons (Matt. 5-7)
6. Face to face conversations (Deut. 5:4).
7. Tablets of Stone (Deut. 10:4)
8. Miracles (John 6)
9. Parabels (Luke 15)
10. Inner compulsion (Acts 21:10-13)
11. History (1 & 2 Chron.)
12. Angels (Luke 1:26-30)
13. Research (Luke 1:1-4)
14. The person of Christ (John 1:14)

Gods means of revelation TODAY is the Bible. When God wanted Peter to preach the gospel to the Gentiles, He imparted this through a vision (Acts 10). Even then, Peter appears to have been reluctant to obey God completly.

Today we do not depend on dreams and visions to learn about God and His will for our lives, but rather on God's revelation in the Scriptures. God did not impart the gospel to Cornrlius in a vision but commanded a MAN to preach the Word of God to him.

Having said that and understood it we can then read Hebrews in a better lite. Christ's POWER, PERSON and POSITION are all seen in those verses 1-3. Now, today, God has spoken finally through His Son Jesus.
If God spoke out of heaven at this very moment, He would repeat something which He has already said because my friend, we have the last word from God to this world in Jesus Christ.

Matt. 17:5
""This is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased, HEAR YE HIM".
Since the Father has given His final word in the Lord Jesus, it is the final word for you me me as well. It is the Son who is the One before us in the verses you asked about.

As for apostles receiving the revelation from God, you must remember that the reason for them being apostles was to do just that. According to the Scriptures that was exactly what they were to do. But there are no apostles today because of the fact that we now have the completed Word of God.
 
Simple as it seems to be, this "test for spirits" requires divine revelation to apply it. How come it simply states, "Confessing Jesus Christ is come in the flesh" is enough to have passed the test. WHO is Jesus Christ BEFORE coming in the flesh. This is core of the test.

Let us remember it was the Father who made the "testament of salvation" in the Old Testament.
What is the requisite for the fulfillment of the "testament" accordng to Paul in Heb 9:16?

Your question was......................
WHO is Jesus Christ BEFORE coming in the flesh. This is core of the test.

The Bible says............................
“Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever” ( Heb. 13:8).

“I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed”. (Malachi 3:6),

“I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed”.

Jesus the Christ in his glorified FORM remains the SAME yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

“Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them” (Heb. 7:25).

What is the requisite for the fulfillment of the "testament" accordng to Paul in Heb 9:16
DEATH!!

But what was required for the perfection of the saints????????

THE RESURRECTION!

Colossians 3:1..........
"If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God".
 
Following human wisdom of the aforementioned verses as regards "God does not change," how come Jesus Christ who is GOD His human body changed His form after His resurrection and became in His "glorified body" that can do many things thereafter, not otherwise possible before?

Hence, we should expect God through His very words, by divine revelation, to reveal to us WHO really is Jesus Christ BEFORE "coming in the flesh."

And this "divine revelation," any person professing to know Jesus Christ no longer is subject to His rebuke in:

* John 8:19 Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.
 
Following human wisdom of the aforementioned verses as regards "God does not change," how come Jesus Christ who is GOD His human body changed His form after His resurrection and became in His "glorified body" that can do many things thereafter, not otherwise possible before?

Hence, we should expect God through His very words, by divine revelation, to reveal to us WHO really is Jesus Christ BEFORE "coming in the flesh."

And this "divine revelation," any person professing to know Jesus Christ no longer is subject to His rebuke in:

* John 8:19 Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.

I wish I could figure out what in the world you are trying to say. I think it would be interesting, but I 'll be danged if I know!!!

Jesus was the Son of God before His birth. He was the Son of God while clothed in flesh here on this eart. He was the Son of God when He died on the cross and He was the Son of God when He rose from the dead. He is also the Son of God today as He sits at the right hand of God the Father.

Now if you really want something to take away your breath, consider this...........When Jesus was in diapers, 100% man and 100% God, He kept the planets in perfect order and the earth rotating around the Sun and the solar system in perfect harmony. He controlled every star in the universe!!!! Staggering thought is it not?????
 
I wish I could figure out what in the world you are trying to say. I think it would be interesting, but I 'll be danged if I know!!!

Jesus was the Son of God before His birth. He was the Son of God while clothed in flesh here on this eart. He was the Son of God when He died on the cross and He was the Son of God when He rose from the dead. He is also the Son of God today as He sits at the right hand of God the Father.

Now if you really want something to take away your breath, consider this...........When Jesus was in diapers, 100% man and 100% God, He kept the planets in perfect order and the earth rotating around the Sun and the solar system in perfect harmony. He controlled every star in the universe!!!! Staggering thought is it not?????

Indeed very clear to the Natural Man, but something lacking in the "eyes of God." For how could Jesus Christ have to rebuke those who claim to know Him with:

* John 8:19 Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.
And, how could Jesus make such a "simple test" by just declaring, " He (Jesus) has come in the flesh?" Presto! That seems to be OK, and yet Christianity divided in their identification of Jesus Christ," at the same time cannot identify the Father and feeling contented with His "description."
 

Ginger

Inactive
Following human wisdom of the aforementioned verses as regards "God does not change," how come Jesus Christ who is GOD His human body changed His form after His resurrection and became in His "glorified body" that can do many things thereafter, not otherwise possible before?...........

Has the question now changed to "How can the unchangable God change?"

I am very curios to discover what the topic of this thread is. Does anyone know?

I have been getting the feeling this is an attempt to deny Jesus is God incarnate, without actually coming out and saying so, for some time now. If that is so, it needs to be stated so that people respond to the issue at hand and stop talking about everything else.

So, even tho I have nothing to offer this thread, I would like to follow it, but I can't if no one knows what anyone is talking about. Or am I the only one who doesn't know?

fil3232003, Can you please state the topic of this thread in one clear and concise statement? Please, so I can follow along.
smile.png
Please?
 
Top