What Does Baptism Mean To You

[Major]

When you get Baptized as taught in Acts 2 v 38/ John 3 v 3 &5 Your heart gets circumcised instead of your privates. It is commonly taught in Churches who teach the correct Baptismal Formula. I have also showed you in First Peter, when he associates the saving of those on Noah' s Ark to a water baptism salvation. Peter stated " Likewise as Water Baptism now SAVES us"....are you saying Apostle Peter, The one Jesus gave the " Keys" unto in Matthew 16 does not know what he is saying?
Puleeeeeeeze!!!!

Brother........it is not there!

Acts 2:38
"Then Peter said unto them, repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost".

Not one single word about "Circumcision".

John 3:5
Jesus answered verily verily, I say to you, except a man be born of water and of the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God".

Rick, if you will google Bible teachers/commentators you will see that thw "Water" here is a representation of the Word of God which Jesus said was the Water of life.

Rom. 10:17
"Faith come by hearing, AND HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD".

Nothing there about circumcision either.

 

[Major]

Please do not misquote me. I have never said that baptism by itself saves. The promise is in the words [shall be]. Jesus said, "He that believes AND is baptized shall be saved." Neither Jesus, nor I, said "He that is baptized shall be saved." So was the Lord Jesus in error when he promised salvation to "He that believes and is baptized..."?

I posted your exact word my friend. That is no misquote in any way.

You can talk it away any way you like, but there it is. Now you have to own it. That is the draw back to the new age of technology.
When said.....allways there.

 

[Major]

Actually when he remarked " Not being so silly to believe Water Baptism Saves anyone" is when he showed his true colors so to speak. You can show him verse after verse and he still won' t believe it. So it is sort of a car on Ice you spin your wheels trying to show him to no avail. Jesus tells us not to " Throw your pearls to the Swine"
perfect fit for this situation...oink, oink..

I would not ever call you that Rick.

And you can not show anywhere in the Bible verses that tell us Baptism is necessary for salvation.

 

[Ricko1]

Brother........it is not there!

Acts 2:38
"Then Peter said unto them, repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost".

Not one single word about "Circumcision".

John 3:5
Jesus answered verily verily, I say to you, except a man be born of water and of the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God".

Rick, if you will google Bible teachers/commentators you will see that thw "Water" here is a representation of the Word of God which Jesus said was the Water of life.

Rom. 10:17
"Faith come by hearing, AND HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD".

Nothing there about circumcision either.

I never said it was a Bible verse...I stated it is commonly known as circumcision of
the heart. In other words like when someone says " Your making me climb the walls"
it is a saying..talking about what takes place when you undergo Repentant baptism...your old sinful lifestyle is " cut out" of you...get it??

 

[Major]

I never said it was a Bible verse...I stated it is commonly known as circumcision of
the heart. In other words like when someone says " Your making me climb the walls"
it is a saying..talking about what takes place when you undergo Repentant baptism...your old sinful lifestyle is " cut out" of you...get it??

Yes Rick, I got it. I do not accept it, but I got it.

 

[Candelario Mario Villa]

"And I will give to you the keys of the kingdom of heaven...". (Matt. 16:19) "...and you shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost parts of the world." (Acts 1:8)
The Apostle Peter was the first to preach the gospel: first in Jerusalem and in all Judea, where about 3,000 souls were baptized; then in Samaria, where "...they prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Spirit: (for as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the NAME of the Lord Jesus.)" Finally, Peter preached to the Gentiles in the house of Cornelius, the Centurion, and "...they heard them speaking with tongues and magnify God. Then answered Peter, 'can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized which have received the Holy Spirit the same as we?"
So the order of the preaching of the gospel is repentance, baptism, and receiving the Holy Spirit; to the Jews first, then the Samaritans, and finally to the Gentiles. They all received the same gospel, baptized in the same NAME, and received the promise of the Holy Spirit.
Tell me: when did the order change, and who changed it?

 

[Major]

I agree...Water Baptism in itself will save someone IF THEY PASS up Repentance with a true heart fell repentance.

Water Baptism is symbolic of The Death, Burial, and Resurrection Of Jesus and identifies us who do as commanded as his Children..

Rich. What you need is proper Bible understanding my friend.

As with any single verse or passage, we discern what it teaches by first filtering it through what we know the Bible teaches on the subject at hand. In the case of baptism and salvation, the Bible is clear that salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works of any kind, including baptism (Ephesians 2:8-9). So, any interpretation which comes to the conclusion that baptism, or any other act, is necessary for salvation, is a faulty interpretation.

Those who believe that baptism is required for salvation are quick to use 1 Peter 3:21 as a “proof text,” because it states “baptism now saves you.” Was Peter really saying that the act of being baptized is what saves us? If he were, he would be contradicting many other passages of Scripture that clearly show people being saved (as evidenced by their receiving the Holy Spirit) prior to being baptized or without being baptized at all, like the thief on the cross in Luke 23:39-43 which I have already spoken to.

A good example of someone who was saved before being baptized is Cornelius and his household in Acts 10. We know that they were saved before being baptized because they had received the Holy Spirit, which is the evidence of salvation (Romans 8:9; Ephesians 1:13; 1 John 3:24). The evidence of their salvation was the reason Peter allowed them to be baptized. Countless passages of Scripture clearly teach that salvation comes when one believes in the gospel, at which time he or she is sealed “in Christ with the Holy Spirit of promise” (Ephesians 1:13).

Thankfully, though, we don’t have to guess at what Peter means in this verse because he clarifies that for us with the phrase “not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience.”

Do you see it Rick. Do you understand it??? While Peter is connecting baptism with salvation, it is not the act of being baptized that he is referring to - not the removal of dirt from the fles. Being immersed in water does nothing but wash away dirt.

 

[Major]

"And I will give to you the keys of the kingdom of heaven...". (Matt. 16:19) "...and you shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost parts of the world." (Acts 1:8)
The Apostle Peter was the first to preach the gospel: first in Jerusalem and in all Judea, where about 3,000 souls were baptized; then in Samaria, where "...they prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Spirit: (for as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the NAME of the Lord Jesus.)" Finally, Peter preached to the Gentiles in the house of Cornelius, the Centurion, and "...they heard them speaking with tongues and magnify God. Then answered Peter, 'can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized which have received the Holy Spirit the same as we?"
So the order of the preaching of the gospel is repentance, baptism, and receiving the Holy Spirit; to the Jews first, then the Samaritans, and finally to the Gentiles. They all received the same gospel, baptized in the same NAME, and received the promise of the Holy Spirit.
Tell me: when did the order change, and who changed it?

OK. When did the thief on the cross get baptized.???

Did they take him down and baptize him and then put him back on the cross.?
Did they baptize him after he was dead?
When then did he receive the Holy Ghost????

Jesus promised him that he would be in paradise that day?

Did Jesus lie?

The bottom line which you can never explain is that if baptism was need for salvation as you say, they the thief went to torments....correct?

1 Corh. 1:17
"For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel".

Again I say to you......baptism should be a part of every believers experience, but it is not a requirement for salvation.

Dr. Kenneth Wuest, author of Word Studies in the Greek New Testament says..............
" But he says that it saves them only as a counterpart(Water Baptism). That is, water baptism is the counterpart of the reality, which is salvation itself. It can only save as a counterpart, not actually. The Old Testament sacrifices were counterparts of the reality, the Lord Jesus. They did not actually save the believer, only in type. It is not argued here that these sacrifices are analogous to Christian water baptism. The author is merely using them as an illustration of the use of the word 'counterpart.'

He goes on to say further.......
"So water baptism only saves the believer in type. The Old Testament Jew was saved before he brought his offering. That offering was only his outward testimony that he was placing faith in the Lamb of God of whom these sacrifices were a type....Water baptism is the outward testimony of the believer's inward faith. The person is saved the moment he places his faith in the Lord Jesus. Water baptism is the visible testimony to his faith and the salvation he was given in answer to that faith.

Now we can keep doing this for as long as you like but you are never going to get me to believe what you are trying to teach, never! So with that in mind I am going to let someone else pick up the slack and I am going to move on.

I enjoyed the conversation and look forward to more discussions with you my brothers.

 

[Candelario Mario Villa]

Yes Rick, I got it. I do not accept it, but I got it.

"But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."

I posted your exact word my friend. That is no misquote in any way.

You can talk it away any way you like, but there it is. Now you have to own it. That is the draw back to the new age of technology.
When said.....allways there.

Beloved, what you posted was your interpretation of what i wrote. You are seeing what you want to see, even as you are believing what you want to believe. Be careful not to close your eyes and stop your ears to the gospel that saves.

 

[Ricko1]

Rich. What you need is proper Bible understanding my friend.

As with any single verse or passage, we discern what it teaches by first filtering it through what we know the Bible teaches on the subject at hand. In the case of baptism and salvation, the Bible is clear that salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works of any kind, including baptism (Ephesians 2:8-9). So, any interpretation which comes to the conclusion that baptism, or any other act, is necessary for salvation, is a faulty interpretation.

Those who believe that baptism is required for salvation are quick to use 1 Peter 3:21 as a “proof text,” because it states “baptism now saves you.” Was Peter really saying that the act of being baptized is what saves us? If he were, he would be contradicting many other passages of Scripture that clearly show people being saved (as evidenced by their receiving the Holy Spirit) prior to being baptized or without being baptized at all, like the thief on the cross in Luke 23:39-43 which I have already spoken to.

A good example of someone who was saved before being baptized is Cornelius and his household in Acts 10. We know that they were saved before being baptized because they had received the Holy Spirit, which is the evidence of salvation (Romans 8:9; Ephesians 1:13; 1 John 3:24). The evidence of their salvation was the reason Peter allowed them to be baptized. Countless passages of Scripture clearly teach that salvation comes when one believes in the gospel, at which time he or she is sealed “in Christ with the Holy Spirit of promise” (Ephesians 1:13).

Thankfully, though, we don’t have to guess at what Peter means in this verse because he clarifies that for us with the phrase “not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience.”

Do you see it Rick. Do you understand it??? While Peter is connecting baptism with salvation, it is not the act of being baptized that he is referring to - not the removal of dirt from the fles. Being immersed in water does nothing but wash away dirt.

You know we need just part ways. You are arguing against Pure Gospel with no way, Shape, or form are you going to see the Gospel the way it is stated. You pose question after question after being shown the scriptures. So I say goodbye, not that I do not know the scripture but because it is a waste of time..Adios..

 

[RosaVera]

Why bother? Whatever I say, you just won't believe it anyway. This is a debate that will never end because you are bound and determined to prove The Catholic Church is the original and only true Church when in reality on both counts is falsehood.

Anyone with a normal understanding can see the RCC does not adhere to what Jesus and The Original Apostles taught

Do Catholics Baptize only those old enough to believe as taught in the scriptures? NO

Does The Catholic Church teach Salvation comes through obedience to the word of God and following his commands, or do they teach it comes only through them?

Why is the Catholic Church the Only Church That is a full voting member of the ungodly United Nations? I never knew God wants us to join Political groups to do his will?!!

Why was the Catholic Church the only country ( The Vatican) To have a concordant with Nazi Germany during World War II, while Hitler was murdering 6 Million Jews, and the RCC turned a blind eye to all of it. They even supported
Benito Musselini..

And why not Google " Vatican/ Nazi Photos"
to see for yourself pictures that don' t lie, Where priests and Bishops giving the Heil Hitler salute, and a great photo of Pope Pius XII sitting with Nazi Ambassador Franz Von Poppen in the Vatican.

Address this first and we'll continue our Bible study..Thanks!

YOU cannot seem to conduct a conversation without inducting the word Catholic in it when you speak because in your opinion no one is a brethren Christian unless they are like you. You bypass any that is being talked about in order to demean Catholics, if neither i nor Lysander would have declared bravely which church we worship in you would not be talking in this manner.

When the devil tempted our Lord Jesus and he even dragged him to the top of the mountain if YOU were taking a photo of our Lord next to the devil you would blast it that our Lord was in communion with the devil...?

Accept Christians for being Christian and conduct yourself as a Christian, your words are blasphemy to me when you speak of the mother of our Lord... your words show you like a petty little person angered at all women, if you can speak thus of our Blessed Mother how can you speak well of any woman...?

 

[Candelario Mario Villa]

YOU cannot seem to conduct a conversation without inducting the word Catholic in it when you speak because in your opinion no one is a brethren Christian unless they are like you. You bypass any that is being talked about in order to demean Catholics, if neither i nor Lysander would have declared bravely which church we worship in you would not be talking in this manner.

When the devil tempted our Lord Jesus and he even dragged him to the top of the mountain if YOU were taking a photo of our Lord next to the devil you would blast it that our Lord was in communion with the devil...?

Accept Christians for being Christian and conduct yourself as a Christian, your words are blasphemy to me when you speak of the mother of our Lord... your words show you like a petty little person angered at all women, if you can speak thus of our Blessed Mother how can you speak well of any woman...?

Beloved, we need to differentiate between the people and institutional doctrine.
I know that there are many people all over the world who will believe the gospel, and many that will not. But both who will and will not are getting hindrance, intentionally or not, from their "...country, from their kindred, and from their father's house...": each a form of institution. God knows how to divide the sheep from the goats, and the cattle from the cattle.

The devil did not, and could not, drag the Lord Jesus anywhere. Do not be deceived, Beloved, the devil never had any power over the Lord Jesus, although Jesus allowed himself to be tempted...to defeat satan on satan's own terms.

Yes, Mary is the mother of Jesus, who was conceived by God's Spirit while she was a virgin. Yet she is neither the mother of God, nor our intercessor to God. Our sole intercessor is "...the man, Christ Jesus...".

Who is a Christian? One who was first a disciple of Jesus Christ. Where does discipleship begin? When one first repents, and is baptized "...in the NAME of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins...". Christians accept Christians everywhere we go: and we also accept those who are being called to salvation, even though they, themselves, don't understand it. But we also know that "...he that is born of the flesh, is flesh; and he that is born of the Spirit, is spirit."

 

[Brother David]

I love you brother, but you know the answer to the questions you are asking me. Come on.

I have been very clear here for several years not just since you came on board. And by the way, once we get past this baptize thing, I think we will have a great time conversing....but

One can not reject the gospel and accept Christ as they are the same thing. Accepting Christ IS ACCEPTING THE GOSPEL and if you are hearing something different than that, then it is YOUR problem of hearing or better said reading.What ever YOUR gospel is, where you have included baptism is simply not taught in the Scriptures as I have already posted them for you.

Now as for the hospital or battlefield. No one can just fluff that off with the answer......
." Again, we are not (I hope) in a deathbed nor battlefield situation. "

All of life is a battlefield my brother. We are in hand to hand combat with the devil over the souls of humanity! IT IS A WAR and millions of people are saved in combat and in hospitals. That is what we do as soul winners and preachers. We go to where the battle is whether it is in a home, a pew, a school, hospital or war zone.

I am not asking you to reject Peter, or Paul or Jesus or James. I am asking you to believe them and put aside something as silly as having to be wet to be saved.

Define "The Gospel" please and we will begin from there......Thanks

 

[Major]

Beloved, we need to differentiate between the people and institutional doctrine.
I know that there are many people all over the world who will believe the gospel, and many that will not. But both who will and will not are getting hindrance, intentionally or not, from their "...country, from their kindred, and from their father's house...": each a form of institution. God knows how to divide the sheep from the goats, and the cattle from the cattle.

The devil did not, and could not, drag the Lord Jesus anywhere. Do not be deceived, Beloved, the devil never had any power over the Lord Jesus, although Jesus allowed himself to be tempted...to defeat satan on satan's own terms.

Yes, Mary is the mother of Jesus, who was conceived by God's Spirit while she was a virgin. Yet she is neither the mother of God, nor our intercessor to God. Our sole intercessor is "...the man, Christ Jesus...".

Who is a Christian? One who was first a disciple of Jesus Christ. Where does discipleship begin? When one first repents, and is baptized "...in the NAME of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins...". Christians accept Christians everywhere we go: and we also accept those who are being called to salvation, even though they, themselves, don't understand it. But we also know that "...he that is born of the flesh, is flesh; and he that is born of the Spirit, is spirit."

Good points my friend. But there are some I have to disagree with you on because they are simply not Biblical.

1. " God knows how to divide the sheep from the goats, and the cattle from the cattle."

I would agree with that.

John 11:25-26...........
"Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, 26 and everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die. Do you believe this?"

2. "Do not be deceived, Beloved, the devil never had any power over the Lord Jesus".

Agreed!

Luke 4:4
"And Jesus answered him, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone.’”

3. "Yes, Mary is the mother of Jesus, who was conceived by God's Spirit while she was a virgin. Yet she is neither the mother of God".

There are many confusing thoughts in the world as to who/what was Jesus. That is where your statement has its roots.
"Whom do you say Jesus is?" Your question is the line usually drawn by the Catholic believers against the Protestant believers.
Personally, I am a Protestant with many, may Catholic friends. I do understand the argument but we have to consider whether Colossians 1:20 is true or not true IMHO. For that reason I have to disagree with you.

Colossians 1:20
"For in him all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell".

4. (Mary) " nor our intercessor to God. Our sole intercessor is "...the man, Christ Jesus...".

Agreed!

Hebrews 7:25
"Consequently, he is able to save to the uttermost[a] those who draw near to God through him, since he always lives to make intercession for them."

5. "Who is a Christian? One who was first a disciple of Jesus Christ. Where does discipleship begin? When one first repents, and is baptized "...in the NAME of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins...".

Well, we have hashed this back and forth a lot but here it is again.

You are saying a man becomes a disciple when he repents and is baptized.

I understand the Scriptures to say that a man is saved the moment he trusts Christ as his Saviour. Period. If anything is added to that experience, it detracts from the miracle of God's grace and diminishes from Jesus the work He did on the cross.

John 19:30 tells us that Jesus said....."IT IS FINISHED".
The plan of God for humanity was done, finished, in place and that indicates that there is nothing that can be added to what Jesus did on the cross.

 

[Ricko1]

Good points my friend. But there are some I have to disagree with you on because they are simply not Biblical.

1. " God knows how to divide the sheep from the goats, and the cattle from the cattle."

I would agree with that.

John 11:25-26...........
"Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, 26 and everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die. Do you believe this?"

2. "Do not be deceived, Beloved, the devil never had any power over the Lord Jesus".

Agreed!

Luke 4:4
"And Jesus answered him, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone.’”

3. "Yes, Mary is the mother of Jesus, who was conceived by God's Spirit while she was a virgin. Yet she is neither the mother of God".

There are many confusing thoughts in the world as to who/what was Jesus. That is where your statement has its roots.
"Whom do you say Jesus is?" Your question is the line usually drawn by the Catholic believers against the Protestant believers.
Personally, I am a Protestant with many, may Catholic friends. I do understand the argument but we have to consider whether Colossians 1:20 is true or not true IMHO. For that reason I have to disagree with you.

Colossians 1:20
"For in him all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell".

4. (Mary) " nor our intercessor to God. Our sole intercessor is "...the man, Christ Jesus...".

Agreed!

Hebrews 7:25
"Consequently, he is able to save to the uttermost[a] those who draw near to God through him, since he always lives to make intercession for them."

5. "Who is a Christian? One who was first a disciple of Jesus Christ. Where does discipleship begin? When one first repents, and is baptized "...in the NAME of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins...".

Well, we have hashed this back and forth a lot but here it is again.

You are saying a man becomes a disciple when he repents and is baptized.

I understand the Scriptures to say that a man is saved the moment he trusts Christ as his Saviour. Period. If anything is added to that experience, it detracts from the miracle of God's grace and diminishes from Jesus the work He did on the cross.

John 19:30 tells us that Jesus said....."IT IS FINISHED".
The plan of God for humanity was done, finished, in place and that indicates that there is nothing that can be added to what Jesus did on the cross.




When someone " Beleives" means they not only " Beleive" in Jesus, but his gospel and all teachings goes with it..

 

[Major]

Define "The Gospel" please and we will begin from there......Thanks

Really Dave?

1 Cor. 15:2-3............
"By this gospel you are saved...that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, and that he appeared to Peter, and then to the Twelve. After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers at the same time..."

Paul explains the three elements of the gospel—the death, burial and resurrection of Christ on our behalf. Our old nature died with Christ on the cross and was buried with Him. Then we were resurrected with Him to a new life (Romans 6:4-8). Paul tells us to “hold firmly” to this true gospel, the only one which saves. Believing in any other gospel is to believe in vain. In Romans 1:16-17, Paul also declares that the true gospel is the “power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes” by which he means that salvation is not achieved by man’s efforts, but by the grace of God through the gift of faith (Ephesians 2:8-9).

 

[Ricko1]

Good points my friend. But there are some I have to disagree with you on because they are simply not Biblical.

1. " God knows how to divide the sheep from the goats, and the cattle from the cattle."

I would agree with that.

John 11:25-26...........
"Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, 26 and everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die. Do you believe this?"

2. "Do not be deceived, Beloved, the devil never had any power over the Lord Jesus".

Agreed!

Luke 4:4
"And Jesus answered him, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone.’”

3. "Yes, Mary is the mother of Jesus, who was conceived by God's Spirit while she was a virgin. Yet she is neither the mother of God".

There are many confusing thoughts in the world as to who/what was Jesus. That is where your statement has its roots.
"Whom do you say Jesus is?" Your question is the line usually drawn by the Catholic believers against the Protestant believers.
Personally, I am a Protestant with many, may Catholic friends. I do understand the argument but we have to consider whether Colossians 1:20 is true or not true IMHO. For that reason I have to disagree with you.

Colossians 1:20
"For in him all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell".

4. (Mary) " nor our intercessor to God. Our sole intercessor is "...the man, Christ Jesus...".

Agreed!

Hebrews 7:25
"Consequently, he is able to save to the uttermost[a] those who draw near to God through him, since he always lives to make intercession for them."

5. "Who is a Christian? One who was first a disciple of Jesus Christ. Where does discipleship begin? When one first repents, and is baptized "...in the NAME of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins...".

Well, we have hashed this back and forth a lot but here it is again.

You are saying a man becomes a disciple when he repents and is baptized.

I understand the Scriptures to say that a man is saved the moment he trusts Christ as his Saviour. Period. If anything is added to that experience, it detracts from the miracle of God's grace and diminishes from Jesus the work He did on the cross.

John 19:30 tells us that Jesus said....."IT IS FINISHED".
The plan of God for humanity was done, finished, in place and that indicates that there is nothing that can be added to what Jesus did on the cross.


" It is finished" meaning bis sacrifice for We sinners. It also means there is nothing else to add unto what was to be taught. How can a person " Accept Jesus" then deny the teachings or argue the doctrine? that is denial not acceptance..

 

[Ricko1]

You can not be a true Christian unless you follow the doctrines put forth by Jesus and Apostles. Repentance, Water Baptism in Jesus' Name, Receiving The Holy Ghost, Holiness in word and deed, and following the Gospel.

 

[Major]

You can not be a true Christian unless you follow the doctrines put forth by Jesus and Apostles. Repentance, Water Baptism in Jesus' Name, Receiving The Holy Ghost, Holiness in word and deed, and following the Gospel.

Well, we are not going to agree but we will still be brothers in Christ. If you think that water baptism is essential, I certainly am not going to be able to change you.

I will however repeat what I have already said about baptism. Converts to Judaism were baptized in a ritual bath called a Mikvah. This immersion was a public statement that you wanted to join a community of faith, that you believed as they did, and that you intended to live that way. There are other uses for MIKVAH, such as in preparation for beginning ministry as a Jewish priest, cleansing tools and utensils for use in the Temple, and so on.

When Jesus was baptized, He was beginning His ministry. When those who came after Him were baptized, they were making a public statement of their belief in Jesus as the Messiah, and of their intention to join the Christian community. There’s no part of the ritual that leads to salvation.
Of course, Christians were commanded to be baptized in Scripture…but not until they were Christians. While there are certainly a few verses that appear to teach that baptism cleanses a person from sin, closer inspection shows that they don’t. That is the challenge for those who believe baptism is esential. We have examples of people being saved before baptism, and that should clear things up. I have already given the facts concerning the thief on the cross and just that should answer the question.

God love ya brother!

 

[Ricko1]

Well, we are not going to agree but we will still be brothers in Christ. If you think that water baptism is essential, I certainly am not going to be able to change you.

I will however repeat what I have already said about baptism. Converts to Judaism were baptized in a ritual bath called a Mikvah. This immersion was a public statement that you wanted to join a community of faith, that you believed as they did, and that you intended to live that way. There are other uses for MIKVAH, such as in preparation for beginning ministry as a Jewish priest, cleansing tools and utensils for use in the Temple, and so on.

When Jesus was baptized, He was beginning His ministry. When those who came after Him were baptized, they were making a public statement of their belief in Jesus as the Messiah, and of their intention to join the Christian community. There’s no part of the ritual that leads to salvation.
Of course, Christians were commanded to be baptized in Scripture…but not until they were Christians. While there are certainly a few verses that appear to teach that baptism cleanses a person from sin, closer inspection shows that they don’t. That is the challenge for those who believe baptism is esential. We have examples of people being saved before baptism, and that should clear things up. I have already given the facts concerning the thief on the cross and just that should answer the question.

God love ya brother!

I do not agree with what you have written on this subject. You are not alone..Many Denominal and non demominals also do not believe it either. However when it comes to Scriptural teachings and Following the exact doctrines laid forth; we have no choice but to obey them. There are no loopholes, or other meanings to what was laid out. The Devil of course is the one trying to sew confusion, and miss information.
that is his job....again ....Genesis 3 v 1..." Yea, Hath God Said"?

Please remember, everything God said and recorded by the Apostles, The Writers, has significance and truthful meanings. It takes fervent studying and cross checking, re reading over to catch what all of it means. The Bible is not a literal in meaning.
There are Typologies, Types and Shadows, Parables as well. I have been studying The Bible daily for 27 years myself, and learn something I never saw the first 2,500 times I read it, every week. The key is to not accept anything not proven by solid evidence either written, or demonstrated or both for accuracy.

Even today we see new " Improved" Bibles being introduced, changing the context to confuse people to further miss lead them.

I am not about to repeat over and over what I have already posted regarding the Scriptures several times already. If you so desire to believe what you believe which much is scripturally wrong, and proven wrong, then as the old saying goes " Your Beating a dead horse" by going over and over and over again what I have said, then your choice. I' m here to share and teach TRUTH to anyone who wants to share and even add their own comments. I am not Infinite or all knowing sometimes I learn as well as share...Amen