The shedding of blood (the redemption/ransom price) to cover (atone for) sin and sickness...the resurrection to overcome death.
What Was Finished at the Cross?
- Thread starter Noblemen
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Thank you for your reply. I believe that we need to apply the blood everyday. Our Old Man was crucified with Christ. The sinful nature was not eliminated. Don't we have a new nature that is at war with the sinful nature? (Galatians 5)
Absolutely....keep sowing to the Spirit and grow not weary in well doing and in die season you will reap. As long as we are still in the flesh we will not shed the Old man (Christ in you IS the hope of glory)
Paul
Good point Glo....He has appointed each of us works we are ordained to do (each of us IS His masterpiece (Ephesians 2:10)
Welcome Pinion, it is my understanding that the Sin nature was crucified with Christ on the cross. The battle a believer can have is with the unrenewed mind and the new nature. Romans Seven starts out with Paul showing us there was no deliverance from the sin nature without a death Of that nature. Now we are free to marry another or receive a new nature the divine nature, second Peter 1:4, describes.
Understanding the two natures is really Keystone in our understanding with what God is doing. Really there is no human nature, that is a term that has been coined by men down through the ages. The cross was where the Sin nature was crucified. The moment we believe we receive a new nature, the nature of God is in Christ. Now we can see why we need to be in Christ, there is no other salvation. We need mind renewal to know what happened to us at the cross but more so what happened the moment we believed. We can often mistake the unrenewed mind for the sin nature because it can act just like it.
Mind renewal is an on going process. I like to use the analogy the mind is like a computer with a hard drive. We are being ever renewed to the Christ in us in life expression.
Is Romans 12 a good scripture about renewing the mind?
Welcome Penion!
I agree with you, I have heard opposing views, but I think Paul was testifying to his own sinful nature he was dealing with. The renewing of our minds is part of the battle against our sin nature. Our "old man" dies with Christ, and our "new man" is raised to life through the Holy Spirit baptism. The law does not apply now for we have died with Christ, once you die, the law ceases to apply. We now have the Spirit as our guide, and we need guided because we are still attached to our flesh body. Our sin nature body still wars with the Spirit for control over us, so we must renew our minds to follow the Spirit on our path towards righteousness.
Paul made the statement in , , "I was alive without the law once," paul was never alive without the law, law was still in effect when Paul was born. It's like he was speaking retrospectively as Adam. And the commandment that came was the commandment "not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil." Just a little side note but look at how "the knowledge of good and evil" is one knowledge. The knowledge of good and evil is one knowledge. That is the knowledge that we were left withwhen we received salvation. "there was no miracle for the mind at the cross the miracle was in spirit." So now we will spend the rest of our life getting our minds renewed, the Holy Spirit from that point is our teacher. He is the only one that can teach a believer about the Christ in him.
Do you believe that we inherited our sinful nature, with Adam as the federal head? Do you believe that Christ is the federal head of a new nature, purchased by his blood?
Yes I do believe the sin nature is in the seed. That seed has been handed down from generation to generation. With Adam as it's federal head. I do believe that it what was killed out at the cross and that is why now we need to believe. I believe that when John the Baptist saw Jesus coming to be baptized he said "behold the Lamb of God that taketh away the sin (singular) of the world." I believe a sinner needs to Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and be placed in Christ At that moment to receive the new nature.
If the sinful nature is crucified, why do we keep sinning? Paul certainly had a post-conversion battle with the flesh. Don't we also? I agree that renewal of the mind is essential to spiritual growth. But, there's spiritual warfare out there. Let's put on the armor God has given us. (Ephesians 6)
God's electing love was all we needed, and that came with the plan of salvation from sin.
Tired of Christians saying God wants people to be saved but can't save them. Tired of them saying Christ's death only made it possible. Would Christ go to the cross for the mere possibility of saving his chosen? Bah, he went there to purchase us completely for himself. We are his sheep and children. God fully saves, he doesn't just attempt to.
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Hi Nobleman. Having read your OP I agree with your assessment of "It Is Finished". Some have added their own preconceptions but you sure hit on the basic foundation of that very powerful statement of Jesus. That must have put Satan and all his followers into great confusion because they must have thought "there! We sure fixed the Son of God! He won't bother us anymore."
Ha, Ha! 3 days later, Jesus rose from the dead and brought about a conclusion to "It Is Finished". Oh boy! I'll just bet that all of hell and the forces of evil were shaking in their evil boots.
When I think of It Is Finished, I think of this portion of Scripture....
John 15:1 "I am the true vine, and my Father is the vinedresser. 15:2 Every branch in me that does not bear fruit he takes away, and every branch that does bear fruit he prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 15:3 Already you are clean because of the word that I have spoken to you. 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me. 15:5 I am the vine; you are the branches. Whoever abides in me and I in him, he it is that bears much fruit, for apart from me you can do nothing. 15:6 If anyone does not abide in me he is thrown away like a branch and withers; and the branches are gathered, thrown into the fire, and burned. 15:7 If you abide in me, and my words abide in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 15:8 By this my Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit and so prove to be my disciples. 15:9 As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Abide in my love. 15:10 If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commandments and abide in his love. 15:11 These things I have spoken to you, that my joy may be in you, and that your joy may be full."
As a result of Jesus' death, burial and resurrection, you and I are connected to Jesus in a way that was impossible under the "Old Covenant". Now, we are under the "New Covenant" thru our faith, belief and trust in the God Man who uttered "It Is Finished" Who became our Savior from our sins.
Wow! Just look at this new life that we have in the Vine. Oh, praise the LORD that He reached out to you and me and grafted us into that Holy Vine. Praise YHVH for His unspeakable gift of Salvation and the completed work.
Ha, Ha! 3 days later, Jesus rose from the dead and brought about a conclusion to "It Is Finished". Oh boy! I'll just bet that all of hell and the forces of evil were shaking in their evil boots.
When I think of It Is Finished, I think of this portion of Scripture....
John 15:1 "I am the true vine, and my Father is the vinedresser. 15:2 Every branch in me that does not bear fruit he takes away, and every branch that does bear fruit he prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 15:3 Already you are clean because of the word that I have spoken to you. 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me. 15:5 I am the vine; you are the branches. Whoever abides in me and I in him, he it is that bears much fruit, for apart from me you can do nothing. 15:6 If anyone does not abide in me he is thrown away like a branch and withers; and the branches are gathered, thrown into the fire, and burned. 15:7 If you abide in me, and my words abide in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 15:8 By this my Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit and so prove to be my disciples. 15:9 As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Abide in my love. 15:10 If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commandments and abide in his love. 15:11 These things I have spoken to you, that my joy may be in you, and that your joy may be full."
As a result of Jesus' death, burial and resurrection, you and I are connected to Jesus in a way that was impossible under the "Old Covenant". Now, we are under the "New Covenant" thru our faith, belief and trust in the God Man who uttered "It Is Finished" Who became our Savior from our sins.
Wow! Just look at this new life that we have in the Vine. Oh, praise the LORD that He reached out to you and me and grafted us into that Holy Vine. Praise YHVH for His unspeakable gift of Salvation and the completed work.
Welcome Pinion, it is my understanding that the Sin nature was crucified with Christ on the cross. The battle a believer can have is with the unrenewed mind and the new nature. Romans Seven starts out with Paul showing us there was no deliverance from the sin nature without a death Of that nature. Now we are free to marry another or receive a new nature the divine nature, second Peter 1:4, describes.
Understanding the two natures is really Keystone in our understanding with what God is doing. Really there is no human nature, that is a term that has been coined by men down through the ages. The cross was where the Sin nature was crucified. The moment we believe we receive a new nature, the nature of God is in Christ. Now we can see why we need to be in Christ, there is no other salvation. We need mind renewal to know what happened to us at the cross but more so what happened the moment we believed. We can often mistake the unrenewed mind for the sin nature because it can act just like it.
Mind renewal is an on going process. I like to use the analogy the mind is like a computer with a hard drive. We are being ever renewed to the Christ in us in life expression.
Yea it is finished, now the plan of God could be in full swing by birthing His own children.
Perhaps the matter is just terminology. Anyway, what do you think about the spiritual armor?
1Tim2v3This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.5For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
Here we have an all powerful God who wants all men to be saved, but somehow only manages it for a small portion. The rest can go to hell, literally!
How can an omnipotent and omniscient God fail in his stated desires, unless there was a mitigating factor in common knowledge, so not needed in that passage.
That mitigating factor is freewill, and it alone explains why God's desire that all men be saved cannot happen.
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I am new here. I thought the rules were no Arminianism and no Calvinism (Free-will vs. Predestination). Theologians have spent hundreds of years debating this topic. This subject raises so much ill-will and desention, I'm glad it is banned on this Forum.
Maybe you are right Penion, but not being a theologian, I personally have studied neither of these two "isms".
All I was doing was pointing out a scripture in relation to a previous comment, and asking the obvious question it posed. LOL
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