You posted the second while I was writing the first.
Back to the Law?
- Thread starter Musicmaster
- Start date
You posted the second while I was writing the first.
So, yes, they ARE wrong, and my explanation brings that into glaring contrast.
MM
MM
I do believe we still use the guidance of the letter though - to know what is and is not pleasing to God.
We need, as Christians, the check outside of our selves - that thing which is inerrant to make certain our flesh isn't leading us astray.
Says who?
I'm not trying to be obtuse. I just like to know where the word of God says that we need to study the letter to understand what should already be a part of our nature from the rebirth.
Now, I'm not saying that it's wrong to study the law. No problem. Study is always good where the word of God is concerned.
However, what the HR people are advocating isn't just the study of the letter of the law, but actual physical obedience to all the letter of the law, which only makes them into hypocrites.
How?
They are forced to divide up the law; to carve it into the pieces they can feasibly try to obey, and separate out the parts they cannot, or are not willing to attempt fulfilling. The letter of the law is a unified whole, and nowhere does it make allowances for being divided up into bite-sized morsels that are palatable to the fallen, fleshly taste and conveniences of fallen humanity.
If anyone can show to me otherwise, then I'm wanting to see it. That's a genuine request that I've been verbalizing for a long time now, and to date has gone ignored...or more precisely, showing that they have no proof from the silence of scripture for what they are doing.
MM
Ephesians 6:11-18 - a good read.
What did Jesus use to fight against the temptations thrown at him during the 40 days of testing?
A.) Scripture - a true understanding/application versus twisted.
If we don't have Scripture we have not the full armor of God, to withstand our hour of trial - which are many.
I fully agree with that. Amen.
Now, I will also point out the glaring difference between knowing the scriptures for application of truths, such as man not eating bread alone, and living it as a part of our nature. The letter of the law cannot become a part of our nature apart from it being written within us by the Lord after the rebirth. The written letter can only be lived out by fallen humanity in an attempt at mechanical and intellectual obedience. How far does that ever get us in relation to salvation? Well, most will spend eternity in fire trying to pay the price for that inherent failure.
Conversely, living by what the Law Giver writes into our hearts that we are then able to live "by nature" has a far more profound ability to empower us for obedience at a level far superior to merely letters written on paper.
That's a far cry from going back to the letter of the law and attempting to live it in obedience at a level we humans are simply incapable of performing in the sight of God and men. We're all very good at spotting the imperfections in each other, but God is even better at it.
What I continue to point to is what the Law Giver writes into our inward parts. Living and walking by the Spirit involves our reliance upon the indwelling Spirit and what that same Spirit writes into us inwardly as opposed to what we may read with our eyes.
May I make a statement of an absolute?
No man on this earth can possibly achieve the level of obedience to the written letter of the law as he can at the level of what each man can live from what is a part of his born-again nature defined by what is written within his heart by the Law Giver Himself. It's a comparison between the superior to the inferior, even though the written law is righteous. We simply cannot live it.
MM
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I agree in many ways, but I am stuck by a quote that I believe well said:
“Those that look to be happy must first look to be holy.”
There is a balance in all things. We are temples of the living God after all...
Ten does seem to be a number like that of hundred thousand ten thousands etc in muptiples used as a meptphor to represent all as a unknown the whole law ( scripture) called the letter of the law or what the eyse see on the pages .
I would offer. “Two” throughout the bible represents the one witness of God . .the Father and the Son as one God. The law as to the letter what they eyes see the temporal, again two working as one. The whole bible with, the prophets representing the unseen power of the law. (sola scriptura) Apart from each other no power to makes one new heart soft .
Together they make of the perfect law. . .two become one .The just and justifier.
The law and the prophets the same thing as Moses and the prophets , or Moses and Elias
The prophet Elias representing the unseen power of faith that works in the believer.
Luke 1:17 And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elias, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.
The same two witnesses that made necromancy a law of the fathers without effect in Luke 16 .Teaching us no man can serve two teaching masters. (1) Sola scriptura the witness of God and (2) the oral tradition I heard it through the grape vine oral tradition of fathers, kings and princes the faithless witness of a hierarchy of men that lord it over the non-venerable pew sitters .
The same two witness in Revelation that will be silenced or killed for a short period at the end of the Age the last day under the Sun. When God will sent a famine for hearing the gospel .
Some walking by sight as oral traditons begin to build the abomination of desolation another temple made with human hands .
The first century reformation began over two thousand years ago when Christ made desolate that which make his word void.
Note. . . ( my addition)
1 John 5:9 If we receive the witness of men,( I heard it through the grape vine. . oral traditons) the witness of God is greater: (sola scruiptura all things writen in the law and the prophets). for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.
Yes, without the sting of the law represented by thorns how would a calloused heart hear and waken our souls ? No sting no law..No hearing of faith.
It has also been said that “Holiness differs nothing from happiness but in name,” and “Holiness is happiness in the bud, and happiness is holiness at the full. Happiness is nothing but the quintessence of holiness.”
Agreed! YOU got one right! The bottom line is SIN!
A person must believe that there is a penalty for sin—which is death and Hell—and that we as sinners are deserving of such just punishment from God (Romans 6:23; Revelation 21:8). Why does a man need a Savior if there is nothing to be saved from?
The issue of sin MUST be dealt with! It is not enough to merely turn-over-a-new-leaf, nor to make a commitment to Christ. We are GUILTY of violating God's Law (Romans 3:19). Sin must be paid for! You can either accept God's gift of pardon through the blood sacrifice of Christ Jesus, or you can spend eternity being punished in the Lake of Fire for your own sins.
The choice is completely ours to make. When we come to Christ, Jesus is then our defense Attorney, i.e., advocate, with the Father (1st John 2:1).
He has taken care of our SIN issue for us, washing them away by His own literal blood (Hebrews 9:12,22-24). Jesus did this for us because I obeyed the Gospel, by believing on Jesus as the Christ to forgive my sins (2nd Thessalonians 1:8-9; John 20:31).
The Law of God shows us our vile wicked condition and our desperate need for the Savior. This is why the Ten Commandments were given to mankind (i.e., that our sin might become exceedingly sinful).
Romans 7:13, “...that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.”
We are all guilty of breaking the Ten Commandments, whether by act or thought. Jesus equated lust with adultery and hatred with murder in the Sermon On The Mount (Matthew 5:21-22,28).
Salvation then boils down to these two simple facts:
1. We are SINNERS, and
2. Jesus is the SAVIOR!
You have to include BOTH for salvation. The importance of using the Law to reach the lost cannot be ignored. It is critically important that we present the Law to those we witness to, show them their sinfulness from the Word of God. We should NEVER tell someone that they need Jesus, without telling them WHY they need Jesus―because they are hellbound sinners under the condemnation of God's Law.
John 3:19 states,............
“And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.”
Salvation is simple—we acknowledge our guilt of sin and believe on Christ for forgiveness.
it is care to explain this?
agreed but man makes it hard
Natural, unsaved, Man receives not the things of the Lord, as they are spiritually discerned!
I agree. That is because of reading the literal Word of God, we listen to religious people who try to tell us what God said instead of just reading what God said!
I can try.
When our holiness is perfect, our happiness shall be perfect; and if this were attainable on earth, there would be but little reason for men to long to be in heaven.”
Or we can cite Matthew Henry .......
“Those only are happy, truly happy, that are holy, truly holy,” as he wrote on about Psalms 1:10-3 going so far as to write “goodness and holiness are not only the way to happiness but happiness itself.”
What does that mean???? Who knows. Now lets try plain old country boy english........
If you try to be a holy person, leaving out happiness in God, you can’t do it. There is no such thing as holiness minus happiness in God. Happiness in God is the essence of holiness and VISA VERSA!
These Puritans knew it well. The soul’s true happiness is no incidental byproduct of holiness. True happiness is true holiness.
well our Holiness / sanctification will NOT be complete till we make it to heaven. our happiness is in the Lord. i certainly am not happy with the way the world is going
my self i dont do religion
I have one? Could you spare another ? A million to one LOL
We have to includes both of what? The father and the Son . . .Yes!
Two works of faith or just that of Christ;s labor of love alone? . .The bible say one faith as a work. We have no power . .Just as the Son of man Jesus the chierf apostle who did the will of the fathers having no power of his own. Rather dead creatures they remain powerless of thier own selves just as before we beleived. No life is added to these these bodies of death the wage the 1st death will be carried out .
2 Corinthians 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not U
Salvation is simple—we acknowledge our reveled guilt as those who have received the end of their faith the salvation of ones soul . We can acknowledge by being empowered to agree with our savoir. No one of there own voliation can seek after God No one can understand unles he does the first works as a labor of his love,. Unles he does the first work causing us or empowering one to believe no one can belive. He does all the work or he does nothing.. Again its not something we do to get his approval but what he does in us with us . We had no power of faith as a dead creation.
New creation a born again spirit not a rebuilt or reconditioned, New begining, no end, death , All things are becoming new .