Bullying...why?

[CoffeeDrinker]

There was a man called mendeles who was this medical person who did experiments on all concentration camp people, and he tried to justify it by saying he was saving the healthy people and culling out the weak and sickly. Thats eugenics and it comes from darwinism.

He was tried for crimes against humanity at nuremburg. Many of the worst bullies after the camps were closed, changed their names and went overseas to try and hide from what they did. But there were heaps of witnesses. They couldnt hide forever. They really did want to kill pretty much anyone who wasnt 'aryan. '

So horrific to read about. Its like they were in a factory farm and their spare parts were used for industrial purposes. But they were humans, not animals, but treated worse than animals. And animals can be treated pretty badly even today. People dont seem to think they are Gods creation too.

In 1st grade another kid tried to bully me and said she was going to beat me up after school. After school her and her friends came to me and I stepped up and literally punched her. She left crying and never bothered me again.

Never again in my life was I bullied by a student. My exhusband was a bully and mean to me. I never tolerated it from him either and it always made him mad.

God definitely made me strong. I have no use for that bad behavior.

 

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[Lanolin]

I think its wrong to punch someone back. That just teaches the other person that violence is ok. You may not be bullied again, but the other person will just bully someone else. Because they actually WANT to be violent. Those people are itching for a fight.

Also it is against what Jesus said, which is to love our enemies and pray for those who persecute you. He didnt say go and punch or fight someone back. It also turns you into a bully.

When Im with children, I dont tell them just punch the one whos teasing you or annoying you back. I physically separate them. Otherise the bigger children will just constantly be beating up the smaller ones. When the smaller ones grow up, they then think its ok to bully the smaller ones.

Wrong wrong wrong!

 

[rtm3039]

I think its wrong to punch someone back. That just teaches the other person that violence is ok. You may not be bullied again, but the other person will just bully someone else. Because they actually WANT to be violent. Those people are itching for a fight.

Also it is against what Jesus said, which is to love our enemies and pray for those who persecute you. He didnt say go and punch or fight someone back. It also turns you into a bully.

When Im with children, I dont tell them just punch the one whos teasing you or annoying you back. I physically separate them. Otherise the bigger children will just constantly be beating up the smaller ones. When the smaller ones grow up, they then think its ok to bully the smaller ones.

Wrong wrong wrong!

Hi Lanolin,

Let's contemplate the meaning of the following: " If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone." Romans 12:18 (NIV)).

rtm3039

 

[Lanolin]

I once flatted with someone who had an ex-partner who had a restraining order on him. She had two children from this relationship, but the court decided he couldnt set foot within two metres of the house. I dont know why, probably bullying or physical and verbal abuse.

The weird thing was the court allowed him access to the children, but if he couldnt treat his own mistress right, how are the children safe with him is my question.

 

[rtm3039]

I once flatted with someone who had an ex-partner who had a restraining order on him. She had two children from this relationship, but the court decided he couldnt set foot within two metres of the house. I dont know why, probably bullying or physical and verbal abuse.

The weird thing was the court allowed him access to the children, but if he couldnt treat his own mistress right, how are the children safe with him is my question.

Lanolin,

Ok, if I run this through my cultural filter, "flatted" means house mates and "mistress" means girl friend?

The courts, at least on this side of the ocean, use a different standard for spouse/girlfriend and children; however, they often require such visits to be supervised. It's a bit odd that he could not come within 2 metres (aka: 6 feet). Usually, it's more like 500 feet (aka: 152 metres).

My wife once had to get a restraining order against one of her students. Since it was 500 feet, the school system had to place the student i another school.

rtm3039

 

[Lanolin]

Lanolin,

Ok, if I run this through my cultural filter, "flatted" means house mates and "mistress" means girl friend?

The courts, at least on this side of the ocean, use a different standard for spouse/girlfriend and children; however, they often require such visits to be supervised. It's a bit odd that he could not come within 2 metres (aka: 6 feet). Usually, it's more like 500 feet (aka: 152 metres).

My wife once had to get a restraining order against one of her students. Since it was 500 feet, the school system had to place the student i another school.

rtm3039

Yep. Well he couldnt come near the house, he had to drop the children by the road, he wasnt allowed to come to the door. I might be wrong about the measurements but it seems he did drop them off on the road outside the house but couldnt set foot on the property.

Im not sure if restraining orders are the same as trespass orders. We've had people trepassed from the library. Say if they stole or abused people or were just a general nuisance.

I was reading in deutoronmy if someone accidentally kills someone, God made three cities of refuge people could go so that others wouldnt seek revenge on them. Bullies often want to seek revenge on some imagined slight. You could just be normal and reasonable or even asking a simple question but bullies take it the wrong way.

With Jesus and the Pharisees, I suspect the Pharisees were jealous of Jesus relationship with God. Something they didnt have. The parable of the vineyard shows this. They thought they owned the place, and could do what they like and even killed the vineyard keepers son.

Well we dont really own anything God gives it to us.

 

[Lanolin]

I'm now reading Coretta Scott Kings memoir..she was married to Martin Luther King Jr. I'm quite amazed about the bus boycotts and how things did change in the South when Martin advocated non violence. Coretta home was burned down, they had abusive phone calls and bombs and bricks thrown at them, Martin was stabbed...and got put in prison, but they never advocated fighting back or using violence to stop the racism.

 

[Lanolin]

I remember being spat at by a little kid who was white and told me some racist rubbish about how I didnt belong in 'his country' at the time I remember being angry but just walked on by. He probably learned those racist attitudes from his parents, he said his dad was a cop. I didnt even know this boy. What gives people the right to yell at you and abuse you just for not looking exactly like them.

Anyway, I wonder if parents are still teaching their children how to be bullies. Cos it is rampant, and some workplaces are still really bad with racist attitudes by employers. Or it could even be in reverse which is kinda worse to be told oh we need to employ you to make up diversity in the workplace. I dont want to be employed just because cos I look a certain way. So many people just judge on outward appearances, and men do it a lot with women I have been on the receiving end of that too. Do they not think we already KNOW what we look like and can always look in the mirror if we forget its not like we need other people to tell us.

 

[DavidG]

Dealing with bullies through my life has lead to some of the most formative moments of my faith and personality.

I suspect the instinct to bully, to demean someone else physically or verbally without provocation, is fairly basic to the broken world. We see it across ages, genders, races, and even species.

All of the bullies I've known were desperate people. The bullying may have come off as non nonchalant or second nature, but those I was able to gain the confidence of were all deeply insecure; using it as a poor buffer against their own self-loathing. "I may not see anything good in myself, but as long as there's one person (or people group) worse then me, lower then me then there might be some value to me just by the nature of the fact I'm not them. If someone else is zero, the at least I'm something" It's a contagious thought. When someone punishes you just for being you, you can feel like you are worth less. The idea of being on the bottom of the beat-down totem pole is terrible enough that you can find comfort in someone else's suffering if it means they are on the bottom instead of you.

When I was little I was taught that bullies were the bad guys; that they were somehow more broken than the rest of us. Ethically stunted like the one-dimensional villains in comic books and tv shows of the day.

I remember the first time I saw an incident of severe physical bullying unfolding in front of me. I attacked the bully and knocked him down. He wept with everything he had, just a big pile of hopeless shame on the ground in front of me; enough emotion that it was obvious there was more going on than feeling entitled because he could push people around. At the same time, I had such a rush of self-superior pride at having dethroned the self-proclaimed top dog...I'm afraid to say, broken as he was, I was tempted to hit him again for good measure just to see if I could get that high again. Even though my original intent was to"defend the defenseless"I found my own nature is really susceptible to the same feelings that drove the group (bullies) that I had labeled as lesser humans.

I felt really guilty after the incident. Friends and family praised me for it and tried to convince me I shouldn't feel guilty, but all of their arguments felt like a self-serving. Like we were trying to use the tools of the enemy to fix the broken world, when our faith the answers are separate, holy, outside of the way the flesh thinks.

I know everyone experiences this kind of thing differently, but that's how it played out for me.

 

[Lanolin]

My last incident of bullying was at work when my boss would demean me in front of other co workers.
But the thing is it seemed like he wanted me to fight back, but I didnt. Its like they want to egg you on and make you swear or assault them back as if its a sport or something. Im like ok you think im worthless, but thats just what you think. I know im not in Gods eyes and thats all that matters.

So he could say what he liked and I just ignored him. The co workers were too scared to defend me because they might lose their jobs too.

What happened was heaps of people just left the company including me. . We dont want to work in toxic work environments. So we chose to leave. No job is worth constant daily bullying and contempt. I would pray every day and bind demons so he would stop swearing and being rude...just so I could concentrate on doing my job.

 

[Lanolin]

The other day had an incident of bullying in the library. I have student helpers, and I only let the years 5 and 6 be behind the desk to issue books on the computer. There are only 2 allowed behind the desk, one one the computer and one stamping. Naturally everyone wants to be the one behind the computer.

Two girls volunteered so I said ok, but one was really bossy and insisted she be at the computer. They started fighting over who it would be. I said take turns girls but the bossy one kept insisting she was first. So I said we are going to draw straws. Paper scissors rock. The bossy girl won and teased the other girl who lost and she started to cry. But there was nothing she could do about it.

I said ten minutes each take turns.
After ten mintutes the bossy girl didnt want to give up her chair. The children called me. I stepped in and said in no uncertain terms to her to swap. Also I said to the bossy one I dont like your behaviour, if that happens again you will not be allowed at the desk. She reluctantly gave up her chair.

Ai! WHY???

 

[Lanolin]

One thing came up recently...mockers.

In my other line of work, which I have been posting on facebook, some people feel fit to comment on things I present in a mocking way.

The Bible actually says in psalms not to sit in the seat of mockers.

What is the seat of mockers, its when someone feels fit to make negative judgement on anything others do, demean them and laugh at them. Jesus was mocked on the way to the cross, his garments stolen and people fashioned a crown of thorns for him to wear because they thought he said he was the King of the Jews.

How often is it that people mock others and think its ok? Quite often in fact. Now if you say anything about how its wrong, the mocker will come back at you and say what, cant you take a joke? Or I was ONLY joking. But why the need to make a joke about it?

Jesus did not defend himelf when he was on the cross. Its natural to defend oneself and avoid the onslaught of hatred that others unleash on you, but why did Jesus not say a word? Because he knew His father would vindicate him and avenge those mockers.

I think that is so powerful.

I have just finished reading Coretta Scott Kings memoir. She endured so much, her husband was shot, but in all they did not respond back with violence. They have a center in Atlanta that teaches principles of non violence, that they got from Jesus example. Has anyone been there?

 

[rtm3039]

One thing came up recently...mockers.

In my other line of work, which I have been posting on facebook, some people feel fit to comment on things I present in a mocking way.

The Bible actually says in psalms not to sit in the seat of mockers.

What is the seat of mockers, its when someone feels fit to make negative judgement on anything others do, demean them and laugh at them. Jesus was mocked on the way to the cross, his garments stolen and people fashioned a crown of thorns for him to wear because they thought he said he was the King of the Jews.

How often is it that people mock others and think its ok? Quite often in fact. Now if you say anything about how its wrong, the mocker will come back at you and say what, cant you take a joke? Or I was ONLY joking. But why the need to make a joke about it?

Jesus did not defend himelf when he was on the cross. Its natural to defend oneself and avoid the onslaught of hatred that others unleash on you, but why did Jesus not say a word? Because he knew His father would vindicate him and avenge those mockers.

I think that is so powerful.

I have just finished reading Coretta Scott Kings memoir. She endured so much, her husband was shot, but in all they did not respond back with violence. They have a center in Atlanta that teaches principles of non violence, that they got from Jesus example. Has anyone been there?

Lanolin, "...Because he knew His father would vindicate him and avenge those mockers." I am not all that sure that is the reason Jesus did not "defend himself:" at the cross. “... Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.” (Luke 23: 34, NIV)

 

[Lanolin]

Lanolin, "...Because he knew His father would vindicate him and avenge those mockers." I am not all that sure that is the reason Jesus did not "defend himself:" at the cross. “... Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.” (Luke 23: 34, NIV)

True but he did warn that those who did not believe and actually blasphemed the holy spirit would be condemned to hell. They would not be forgiven in this life or the next.

Which people blasphemed the holy spirit? It would have been some of the Pharisees, who knew what they were doing when they wanted to kill Jesus. The Romans did not really know what they were doing with the cruxifictions, as it was just their justice system but the ones that betrayed and had intents to murder Jesus did.

Back to topic, is bullying intentional? I think it is. Its designed to hurt the target.

 

[rtm3039]

True but he did warn that those who did not believe and actually blasphemed the holy spirit would be condemned to hell. They would not be forgiven in this life or the next.

Which people blasphemed the holy spirit? It would have been some of the Pharisees, who knew what they were doing when they wanted to kill Jesus. The Romans did not really know what they were doing with the cruxifictions, as it was just their justice system but the ones that betrayed and had intents to murder Jesus did.

Back to topic, is bullying intentional? I think it is. Its designed to hurt the target.

Hurt? What about intimidate? Wait, what type of hurt? Physical or emotional?

 

[Lanolin]

Hurt? What about intimidate? Wait, what type of hurt? Physical or emotional?

Well both, though mocking someone can be emotional and physical (Jesus crown of thorns, beating him up, laughing at him, calling him names). Intimidation is usually done through threats. The Pharisees wanted to throw Jesus off a cliff...how did they do that did manhandle him or something or did they just push him or tell him to jump.

It seems they did all that see Luke 4:29

 

[Lanolin]

if bullying starts in the playground these children will grow up to perpetuate it on a bigger scale to include war on a global scale.

To fight back just means both parties will be injured. It wont stop anything. If you fight back, youve already lost. What God tells us to do is RESIST.

So how do we resist. Well there are many ways. Most effective is walking away and not going near the bully. Ignoring the bullys threats and baits.

Children can keep put of an angry adults warpath, have their own spaces and shut the door. Children that annoy each other need to have their own spaces. Overcrowding is an often cause of bullying or an inability to share. Drawing lots can make a contention cease. Nobody can argue with being first or last if its a random draw.

A bullying boss. In all the cases becUse this person thinks they have authority, the only recourse really is for the worker to quit, and not tolerate that behaviour. You will find another job. You can report it, but if its ignored, dont stay there.

A marriage. Well the key here is to identify bullying beahviour BEFORE you say I do. Resist any marriage proposal from a bully But if its too late and you have said I do, well unfortunately marriage vows are until death. But divorce happens because of peoples hard hearts and God does not call us to bondage. Im thankful that all these women I know that had divorced or separated, are actually alive today and their husbands did not kill them. They are testament to being alive and their spirits are not crushed.