I don't care who you are.........that is hilarious!!!!!!!!!
Politics,religeon And The Beast
- Thread starter calvin
- Start date
I don't care who you are.........that is hilarious!!!!!!!!!
Hey Major-I think you might have took Rusty the wrong way; as he does deal with Muslims in his ministry on the now and again-he probably has a good deal of wisdom about their heart condition. They do need Christ just like the rest of us and I think what Rusty was getting at is that the 'Muslim' religion (Islam, etc...) is just as fragmented as our own when it comes to doctrines. I don't think he meant much more than that.
I spent 3.5+ years in Iraq; although I had very little interaction with the Muslims, I can tell you that the 'average Joe' over there is not much different from the average Joe in the USA. They are mislead much like we have churches misleading people in the USA.
I spent 3.5+ years in Iraq; although I had very little interaction with the Muslims, I can tell you that the 'average Joe' over there is not much different from the average Joe in the USA. They are mislead much like we have churches misleading people in the USA.
I agree with your assesment to a point. There are TWO beasts. One is BEAST system which is a religious whore and it is what Daniel describes as you have said..
But Daniel also describes a BEAST MAN who will be the Antichrist and will ride upon the Beast system.
Daniel 9:27
"And HE shall confirm the covenant with many for one week and in the midst of the week HE shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease.............."
The HE who shall confirm the peace treaty is the "little horn" of Daniel 7:8 who will emerge from the fourth Empire which is the Revived Roman Empire or the Beast system.
I see the target as the Jews not Christians as Daniel was A Jew and was speaking to the Jews I see no reason to think the Church is all of a sudden in view. Being someone who believes in the Rapture we can now see that because the Church is removed, God will once again turn His attention to Israel.
That would be the teaching of Replacement Theology and it is not Biblical.
Daniel 9:24
"Seventy weeks are determined upon THY people and upon they holy city..............".
I am very glad to here that Rusty. Words like "ethnicity," "religion," or even "race" are completely irrelevant to our obligations in this life.
Life is preperation to meet God. Did the Jews reject Christ YES! Did ALL the Jews reject Christ NO!
That is not the point and I too have no desire to cross swords with you. The fact is that God is not finished with the Jews and if you want to tail chase anything, do it with the Scriptures not me.
Romans 11:11 he says, “I say then, they did not stumble so as to fall, did they? May it never be! But by their transgression salvation has come to the Gentiles, to make them jealous.” Now watch this. The word “stumbled” means to sin, to fall into sin. Figuratively where did they fall into sin? They rejected righteousness by faith.
Yes, they stumbled.
Then the word “fall” means to fall from a high place to a low place to where you are out of sight. Even though they stumbled, even though they fell, did they fall out of sight? Did they fall from being the apple of God’s eyes in the Old Testament to where they are no longer in His sight? What does he say? “May it never be!” Yes, they missed it, but are they still in God’s eyes? Yes, He still sees them. They didn’t fall so as to fall out of His sight.
calvin ...... you said:
:It may be that the beast will try to operate out of a Christian religion at some time in the future, maybe a protestant, southern baptist mega Church, whatever, but until and unless that happens it is not good to make baseless allegations."
You are so very right. Now may I ask your opinion on the thought that the Beast (A/C) may be an apostate Jew?
Dan. 9:27
"And he (A/C) will confirm the covenant with many for one week (7 years) and in the middle of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease and for the over spreading of abominatiions he shall make it desolate".
This verse clearly states that there will be a sacrifical system in place because the A/C will cause it to come to an end.
Do you have any thoughts on this idea that it will take a Jew to make a peace treaty with the Jews in Israel?
The Jews claim the Messiah will be a man and, therefore, he must be a Jew. Since they are looking for a man, they are ripe for deception. So absolutely. It is not only possible, but quite probable, that the A/C will be Jewish. If not he then the false prophet or both.
please xcuse my delay Major....been rather busy with things here.
I am trying without a great deal of success to figure out what the correct translation of v27 would be. Is this covenant 'the' covenant as the Kjv renders it? Or, is it a 'new' covenant as the Esv seems to suggest? Even the Septuagint seems somewhat vague on this point.
If it is 'the' covenant that is to be confirmed ie. ratified then the bad guy, A/C or beast, would most likely be a non Jewish conquerer who is making a concessional favor to the Jews in allowing the covenant sacrifices to continue such as the Romans did.
If it is a new covenant that is being made, it is difficult to see how this could take place, and how it could include a system of sacrifice unless the covenant maker will be an Emanuel wannabe and therefore a Jew, or at least be able to make a credible claim to be one.
It all hinges on a correct translation I think.
I agree!
Now another question. At what point do you place the invasion of Ezekiel 38?
IF, IF Ezekiel is at the beginning of the Tribulation Period, then a "new peace treaty" to stop the war would then be in view with sacrifices being a consession. Only a Jew would seek such a consession IMO.
Yes by all means the AC could be a christian with the false prophet being Jewish. Or the AC could be Muslim with a Jewish false prophet or vice-versa. It's all so speculative but hard not to indulge.
We are thinking alike............scary isn't it!!
LOL Major. Yes. A little scary.
But, I'll be first to tell you if we are raptured before the Great Tribulation...."I'm so very glad and thankful you were right my brother".
Yep, any being. I know of people who actually think you can get to heaven by spaceship. So you can imagine what would happen with these people if an alien shows up in a spacecraft possessing unheard of knowledge and power, claiming he has seen heaven. He could claim to be Christ and fool many.
Why not? Nimrod thought he could shoot an arrow into heaven......why not try with a Saturn_5 or similar?
Peace treaty as in covenant, yes I think that would be a possibility. Only a Jew would seek that concession, but Major, it doesn't take a Jew to make or grant that concession....it just takes a conquerer.
In particular since the advent of Christ and the grafting in of the gentiles, I doubt that things 'Jewish' need be confined to the Jews. Sacrifices...yes, but not prophetic agendas.
As for Eze 38 and the Gog campaign It could fit in with the latter part of Rev ch 6 and/or Rev 20.
The important thing to remember is that this battle is the final battle that sees an end of evil.
calvin..........do you believe that there are TWO Gog & Magog's or just one.
It seems to me that Ex. 38 and Rev. 20 are two seperate events.
Major, you see one Gog, you've seen them all
I'll pick up on this in a day or so.......busy busy busy.
Times up calvin!
The agents of Satan, be they anti-Christ, Big beast or Junior beast,could be Jewish. What a great cover that would be. With a small percentage of Christendom discounting the Jews as being despised and discounted, and most of the rest of the world
anti-Jewish, the emergence of a charismatic Jew would have a high degree of sales value. Having gone through life rejecting God, the Bible and Jesus, a Jewish person with charisma and showmanship would have the wealth of Jewish heritage and prophesy to bolster his sales pitch. A non Jewish person would have an uphill battle claiming Jewish heritage me thinks.
Well yes, we have seen this already...not with little green men landing on the White-house Lawn, but with SETI looking for ET's who can be our Messiah with their advanced knowledge. Then there was the original "The day the Earth stood still".
The celestial community watching our antics with much distaste, finally wanting to put a big bruiser of a policeman here to maintain peace.
All this stuff just helps to divert attention from the reality of the coming beast.IMO.