What Does Baptism Mean To You

[Ricko1]

We had an Evangelist a few years ago addressing OSAS, and what is commonly referred to as ""Easy Beleivism" Gospel. Wish I had a recording of this and wish every interested individual here, could hear what he said. In Baseball it would have been called a " Grand Slam Home Run". How The Devil has transformed simple daily Bible Reading into TV Shows, Radio shows where you listen instead of reading. Put somebody on TV who dress up and his wife is sweet; the woman adore her...He has a great look, educated, and pushes all the right buttons...And people eat this up like popcorn.

The Devil creates things like this to stop people from READING their Bibles and listen to some Movie Star looking False preacher to lure them in by the millions. I am sure all of you know some of whom I am speaking of. And many of these false teachers are affiliated with certain De nominal Churchs who give their "Blessings" to whatever they preach and teach.

A couple examples....Jim and Tammy Fay Baker

Jimmy Swaggart...and others.

" Rev" Swaggart wound up seeing Prostitutes, blowing his Ministry, yet he was so Charismatic..His TV Ministry did decline...but people still adored him...The Devil laughed at all those foolish people who Continued to trust him, and kept mailing in their " Love Offerings"

Swaggart needs to Repent and seek God in truth and stop being what he is.

Jim and Tammy!! Who could forget this couple! He was so nice, Handsome, people fell in love with them in the 80's. And Miss Tammy. When they first got on TV she actually looked like a Nice sincere Christian Lady...As the years rolled by however..She looked like A Lady of the evening putting it politely. She even made Hollywood Harlots look " Decent" by comparison!

Then we know what happened Jim lusted after his Secretary He and Tammy divorced, The PTL Club folded....and the Devil scored another touchdown so to speak.

And to be totally honest there are preachers in churches right now in every denomination or faith doing the same things but not advertised like the examples I showed.

I said all that to say this...PUT ALL YOUR FAITH and TRUST in Jesus and his word. If your church preaches what Jesus and his Apostles taught and said then listen to that person...BUT READ DAILY anyway. This is rule#1 if you plan to be saved. Never ever look at someone in Church Authority and automatically assume that person knows all the answers, or think in your mind, He is so oooono nice, he has to be right.....don' t do it!!

This is a good subject for everyone to add their thoughts Lord willing...

 

[Major]

Yes, I think it is more on obedience, on righteousness....

Matthew 3:13-15

The Baptism of Jesus
13 Then Jesus came from Galilee to the Jordan to be baptized by John. 14 But John tried to deter him, saying, “I need to be baptized by you, and do you come to me?”
15 Jesus replied, “Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness.” Then John consented.

Yes sir....I agree completely with you!

 

[Ricko1]

Major...Thank You Bro for agreeing It' s all good...God Bless

 

[Candelario Mario Villa]

So here we are: I am at last beginning to understand those who disagree with me about the gospel that saves.
"For by grace are you saved through faith...". There seems to be those who believe that "grace" and the "Holy Spirit" are two distinct gifts. I, on the other hand, believe there is only ONE gift that will raise us from the dead, just as there was only ONE who redeemed us from our sins.
The "gift" that will raise us from the dead is the same commandment that the Lord Jesus received from the Father:
"Therefore does my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I may take it again. No man takes it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have the power to lay it down, and I have the power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father." (Jn. 5:17-18) Power went out from the Father into the Word (commandment): and "...the Word clothed itself in humanity..." (Jn. 1:14), in the womb of a virgin girl. It was the same Word (commandment) that was in Christ, "...reconciling the world unto Himself...". (II Cor. 5:19)
Jesus said, "The words (commandments) that I speak unto you, they are Spirit, and they are life." The Word (commandment) was in Jesus to resurrect Him from the dead: so "...if the Spirit of him that raised Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwells in you."
It stands to reason that if God's word will not "...return unto me void: but it shall accomplish that which I please, and prosper [in the thing] whereto I sent it." (Isa. 55:11) So if the Word that contains the Spirit dwell in you on the Day that God calls back the Word to Himself, the Word that contains the Spirit that dwells in you will raise you from the dead and take you to the father. (I believe some people call that the "rapture")

 

[Mitspa]

One final thought on Water Baptism before I bow out Major. You say you never read where Water Baptism Saves anyone...but then deny what Apostle Peter tells in in I Peter 3 v 20-21. How so? Peter told us we are SAVED by Water Baptism. I agree that is not the only ingredient to be saved...and yes FAITH And Belief in the entire Gospel is all part of it together, and not separate in meaning from the other.

I once declared unto you that if a person is on their death bed and cannot be water baptized then it is in the hands of Our Lord if this person is going to go to heaven. I cannot or you or anybody rightfully claim this person died " Saved"...God himself determines that. Don' t get me wrong...I would love for everyone to be saved. But many will not make it. Simply because they did not follow the exact Bible taught, New Testament Salvation plan as practiced in The first century church started by Jesus and his original Apostles.....OK I am done on this...moving on.

"Saved" is a term that basically means delivered, it does not always mean the traditional idea as to the point of salvation. Here Peter is clearly teaching baptism as a type and a response to salvation. A TYPE, just as the bread and wine represent the Lords body and blood, baptism is a "type" of that which is true in the Spiritual. "Selective legalism", is where some demand that certain scripture are to be taken and placed above other revelation. Paul (by my gospel all will be judged) in no way taught this selective legalism as it relates to baptism. Those who demand that others "follow the EXACT" bible??? NEVER take that approach but to certain passages that promote their own religious agenda. They NEVER do what they demand of others. The Lord HATES hypocrisy above all things.

again lets us look at this scripture:
1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Here is the traditional idea of "saved" and in its proper context. The KJV is a poor translation at times and I Pet 3:20-21 as translated in the KJV is a very weak foundation to attempt to build such doctrines of error.

 

[Ricko1]

Let me see if I understood this exactly as you presented it...You are telling us thus does' nt really mean thus or thus..but your personal interpretation without backup scriptures is the way to go? No, that is wrong...100% wrong. You are perverting the true meaning and context if all the Scriptures regarding how to be saved. There is a Specific Guideline how to do this without debate or controversy. If you don' t follow exactly what it instructs then you not me is being legalistic. I am presenting the Gospel as written. I haven' t forgotten or practiced and wrote anything regarding Salvation not laid forth by Jesus or His chosen Apostles.....

 

[Ricko1]

KJV is " A poor translation"...it is? really??

This is what is printed on the first page of my 1611 King James Edition Bible:

" Translated OUT OF THE ORIGINAL TONGUES, and with PREVIOUS TRANSLATIONS DILIGENTLY COMPARED AND REVISED"

Poor translation? Of course it is..according to just who?!!

 

[Mitspa]

Let me see if I understood this exactly as you presented it...You are telling us thus does' nt really mean thus or thus..but your personal interpretation without backup scriptures is the way to go? No, that is wrong...100% wrong. You are perverting the true meaning and context if all the Scriptures regarding how to be saved. There is a Specific Guideline how to do this without debate or controversy. If you don' t follow exactly what it instructs then you not me is being legalistic. I am presenting the Gospel as written. I haven' t forgotten or practiced and wrote anything regarding Salvation not laid forth by Jesus or His chosen Apostles.....

I have written the truth, and made sound biblical points while pointing out the error of those who promote "selective legalism"
It does not surprise me that you would disagree, but you cannot biblically defeat any point that I have made.

 

[Mitspa]

KJV is " A poor translation"...it is? really??

This is what is printed on the first page of my 1611 King James Edition Bible:

" Translated OUT OF THE ORIGINAL TONGUES, and with PREVIOUS TRANSLATIONS DILIGENTLY COMPARED AND REVISED"

Poor translation? Of course it is..according to just who?!!

You mean your KJV is its own authority? If it says it right, then it must be right? No, my friend, those days are long past and a new Day with the Truth of Christ has come. Let no man subject the truth of God word to an earthly king.
I have many years of study in the "original Greek" I carry a small KJV in my pocket but it is a poor translation at certain points, and to build such a doctrine as many do from the translation in 2 Peter, is just a great error that cannot be supported with the other epistles, especially those of Paul, who is clearly the final word, on all truth in Christ.

 

[Ricko1]

All you folks who adhere to a church following or man made doctrines not supported are really " Skating on thin Ice" with God, Friends.

It is His Way, HIS SACRIFICE, HIS WORD, HIS TEACHINGS...Or the wrong way...You can call it being " Legaliatic" or whatever favorite saying you choose...but read this if you please:

Matthew 7 verses 19-23
( Jesus said) "Wherefore by their fruits you shall know them. Not everyone that saith unto me Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of Heaven: But he that doeth THE WILL OF MY FATHER WHICH IS IN HEAVEN.

Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, HAVE WE NOT
PROPHESIED IN THY NAME? AND IN THY NAME CAST OUT DEVILS? AND IN THY NAME DONE MANY WONDERFUL WORKS?

And then will I profess to them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniguity"

These people Jesus is talking about are those who claimed him, and themselves as his servents, and are stunned they are cast a way. What did' not they do that angered the Lord?

Simply, they cherry picked parts of his teachings that fit their lifestyle and personal thinking; and rejected the other things one needs to do to be an obedient and faithful child of the king. Remember these are " Christians" not Muslims or any other belief system...They Cast out Devils, Did wonderful things, etc IN JESUS' NAME.....Christian beleivers!!

That is exactly why Apostle Paul feared being a Castaway..
I I Thessalonians 15 v 14 & 15
" Where unto he called you by our Gospel, to the obtaining of The Glory of Our Lord Jesus Christ.
Therefore, brethren, Stand Fast, and HOLD THE TRADITIONS WHICH YOU HAVE BEEN TAUGHT, whether by Word, or OUR EPISTLE"

Their EPISTLE, Their TRADITIONS they taught...which is written in the scriptures...not any other traditions or writings that came after they wrote them down and everyone can navigate by...Amen

 

[Ricko1]

You must be using a newer version of the Bible...

Here is verbatim what my KJV states in v 20 &21

20. Which sometime were disobedient, when once the long suffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the Ark was preparing, wherein few, that is eight souls were saved by WATER.

21. The like figure where unto even BAPTISM doth also NOW SAVE US ( Not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God, by the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Amen

Not let us go through these two verses to see exactly what Apostle Peter is saying in meaning....

In Verse 20 Peter is talking about Noah' s Ark and 8 people were saved by the Water they were floating upon in said Ark.

Verse 21..." THE LIKE FIGURE" ( Amount of People or more) Even Baptism Doth ALSO NOW SAVE US not the putting away of the filth of the flesh..( true repentance) but the answer of a good conscience toward God...(Saying our Repentance ALONE will not save us, but Baptism in Water does save us. And of course add Faith, trust, Obedience to God and honor his blood bought Word....All those things save us..Not one without the other. If you " Accept Jesus, as My Personal Savior" To do that in FAITH you MUST ACCEPT and believe in his word also. It does not work any other way.

Why would anyone want to willfully disobey God' s written word, and have their ears tickled by some so called " Preacher" or Pastor, or Evangelust, or whoever who gives a feel good message and lying to people on how to be saved, when he himself has not obeyed or followed God' s exact word?

I have said this a few times on here....Put your FAITH and TRUST In JESUS CHRIST and His Word, or the words spoken by his Original Apostles. That is what we are to do...Believe and do what it says, simple.

The Devil however has another plan...Create different ways to subvert the true plan to get to heaven, and various Denominations, Religions, Faiths to accomplish his goal.

People truly want to be obedient unto God and are sincere and dedicated...But are going to pay an awful price for their trust and man over God and his pure non confusing word..

Want to add this as well...When people use " Accept Jesus Christ as your personal savior and you shall be saved" Usually if they do not tell the p

You mean your KJV is its own authority? If it says it right, then it must be right? No, my friend, those days are long past and a new Day with the Truth of Christ has come. Let no man subject the truth of God word to an earthly king.
I have many years of study in the "original Greek" I carry a small KJV in my pocket but it is a poor translation at certain points, and to build such a doctrine as many do from the translation in 2 Peter, is just a great error that cannot be supported with the other epistles, especially those of Paul, who is clearly the final word, on all truth in Christ.

" A New day with THE TRUTH" saith who? You?

No, a lot of the New Bibles are rearranging words so it has a different meaning then originally spoken I have a book I bought back in the late 1980' s which show each version and rearranged some of the wording to not mean the same thing. When they discovered the Biblical writings found in Southern Israel hidden in Jars in the caves...They discovered The King James was on target..This was on The Book of Isaiah. and other writings.

Makes no difference what Bible they print up, I know and understand it through The Holy Ghost I received. Another subject for a future thread...

 

[Mitspa]

All you folks who adhere to a church following or man made doctrines not supported are really " Skating on thin Ice" with God, Friends.

It is His Way, HIS SACRIFICE, HIS WORD, HIS TEACHINGS...Or the wrong way...You can call it being " Legaliatic" or whatever favorite saying you choose...but read this if you please:

Matthew 7 verses 19-23
( Jesus said) "Wherefore by their fruits you shall know them. Not everyone that saith unto me Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of Heaven: But he that doeth THE WILL OF MY FATHER WHICH IS IN HEAVEN.

Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, HAVE WE NOT
PROPHESIED IN THY NAME? AND IN THY NAME CAST OUT DEVILS? AND IN THY NAME DONE MANY WONDERFUL WORKS?

And then will I profess to them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniguity"

These people Jesus is talking about are those who claimed him, and themselves as his servents, and are stunned they are cast a way. What did' not they do that angered the Lord?

Simply, they cherry picked parts of his teachings that fit their lifestyle and personal thinking; and rejected the other things one needs to do to be an obedient and faithful child of the king. Remember these are " Christians" not Muslims or any other belief system...They Cast out Devils, Did wonderful things, etc IN JESUS' NAME.....Christian beleivers!!

That is exactly why Apostle Paul feared being a Castaway..
I I Thessalonians 15 v 14 & 15
" Where unto he called you by our Gospel, to the obtaining of The Glory of Our Lord Jesus Christ.
Therefore, brethren, Stand Fast, and HOLD THE TRADITIONS WHICH YOU HAVE BEEN TAUGHT, whether by Word, or OUR EPISTLE"

Their EPISTLE, Their TRADITIONS they taught...which is written in the scriptures...not any other traditions or writings that came after they wrote them down and everyone can navigate by...Amen

What is Gods will? Not legalism, for came to deliver us from such bondage. Not the letter "legalism" but the Spirit and liberty.

Ro 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

No my friend, it is not those who reject the hypocrisy of legalism, that should fear Gods wrath, but those who seek to justify themselves in dead works.

Ro 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Ro 2:4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;

 

[Mitspa]

Want to add this as well...When people use " Accept Jesus Christ as your personal savior and you shall be saved" Usually if they do not tell the p


" A New day with THE TRUTH" saith who? You?

No, a lot of the New Bibles are rearranging words so it has a different meaning then originally spoken I have a book I bought back in the late 1980' s which show each version and rearranged some of the wording to not mean the same thing. When they discovered the Biblical writings found in Southern Israel hidden in Jars in the caves...They discovered The King James was on target..This was on The Book of Isaiah. and other writings.

Makes no difference what Bible they print up, I know and understand it through The Holy Ghost I received. Another subject for a future thread...

Yes, those days when certain groups get to beat others over the head with a translation (that has evident errors) and doctrines of legalism, are OVER! Time to move on, that demonic and religious spirit has lost its ability to control, best you allow the Holy Spirit to teach you the true Gospel, and forsake those false traditions.

 

[Candelario Mario Villa]

"Saved" is a term that basically means delivered, it does not always mean the traditional idea as to the point of salvation. Here Peter is clearly teaching baptism as a type and a response to salvation. A TYPE, just as the bread and wine represent the Lords body and blood, baptism is a "type" of that which is true in the Spiritual. "Selective legalism", is where some demand that certain scripture are to be taken and placed above other revelation. Paul (by my gospel all will be judged) in no way taught this selective legalism as it relates to baptism. Those who demand that others "follow the EXACT" bible??? NEVER take that approach but to certain passages that promote their own religious agenda. They NEVER do what they demand of others. The Lord HATES hypocrisy above all things.

again lets us look at this scripture:
b>Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Here is the traditional idea of "saved" and in its proper context. The KJV is a poor translation at times and as translated in the KJV is a very weak foundation to attempt to build such doctrines of error.

The scriptures actually translates: "Being conceived from above (from God)...by the Word of God...". A Christian is first conceived by the preaching of the Gospel; then he enters into the kingdom of God "...of the water and of the Spirit." Folks, there's an entering INTO the kingdom that too many are neglecting!

 

[Ricko1]

AHA..
Here is where you can find all kinds of evidence on Mary, Wafers, etc, good reading for you and any interested as well

(1) Egyptian Trinity USIDLAM.ORG
Talks about where the Wafer originated

(2) All roads lead to Babylon by Ralph Woodrow.

Describes how all Various Holidays originated and Worship of Virgin Goddesses, and lots of other revelations.

(3) The Two Babylons...Alexander Hislop written in 1853...This will answer anyone' s Question on why, where, and how things believed are actually pagan in culture etc...

You did not believe me when I told you last night so read it for yourself. These books are not scripture, but when one reads these revelations from Ancient History, it all fits like a glove. If you or anybody wants to deny what it says, be my guest and send The Books Author or publishing company with any complaints etc. Have a wonderful evening, and a blessed tomorrow..and remember this verse always:

John 8 v 32 " And you shall know the truth and the truth will set you free".

Amen!!

 

[Ricko1]

AHA..
Here is where you can find all kinds of evidence on Mary, Wafers, etc, good reading for you and any interested as well

(1) Egyptian Trinity USIDLAM.ORG
Talks about where the Wafer originated

(2) All roads lead to Babylon by Ralph Woodrow.

Describes how all Various Holidays originated and Worship of Virgin Goddesses, and lots of other revelations.

(3) The Two Babylons...Alexander Hislop written in 1853...This will answer anyone' s Question on why, where, and how things believed are actually pagan in culture etc...

You did not believe me when I told you last night so read it for yourself. These books are not scripture, but when one reads these revelations from Ancient History, it all fits like a glove. If you or anybody wants to deny what it says, be my guest and send The Books Author or publishing company with any complaints etc. Have a wonderful evening, and a blessed tomorrow..and remember this verse always:

John 8 v 32 " And you shall know the truth and the truth will set you free".

Amen!!

Another Great Book to check out ( Maybe on Line) is " Vietnam, Why did we go"?

Explains how the Vatican was fully involved in this to try and make Vietnam Totally Catholic using U.S. Armed Forces and American Catholic Politicians as their Puppets.. Again, It is not scripture but tells all and names names, etc...God Bless.

 

[Lyle_Savant]

It means the I have obeyed John 3:5, being "born of water".

It means that I shall be saved according to Mark16:16, "he that believes AND IS BAPTIZED shall be saved."

It means that my sins have been washed away. Acts 22:16 "And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and WASH AWAY THY SINS calling on the name of the Lord."

It means that I have been saved.
1 Peter 3:21 "The like figure whereunto even baptism DOES ALSO NOW SAVE US (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:"

 

[Mitspa]

The scriptures actually translates: "Being conceived from above (from God)...by the Word of God...". A Christian is first conceived by the preaching of the Gospel; then he enters into the kingdom of God "...of the water and of the Spirit." Folks, there's an entering INTO the kingdom that too many are neglecting!

Not sure where you would get that translation? In effect it does not matter as to the point I made, my point being in regards to salvation and baptism as a "response to salvation", according to the law of faith.

 

[aha]

AHA..
Here is where you can find all kinds of evidence on Mary, Wafers, etc, good reading for you and any interested as well.....
.......
You did not believe me when I told you last night so read it for yourself.

.......

Am not surprised that you noticed that I did not believe you....

Why I do not believe you? or at least am cautious.....

Reason :You seem to be fairly intelligent....

And yet: You have not clearly stated what your church practices in another locked thread

Not clearly answering that question gives me the impression that you are not being honest…. (although I give the benefit of the doubt that the reason can be how I post my question/observation is not clear)

So am reposting again:
see post# 77 of thread:
http://www.christianforumsite.com/threads/the-pope-man-of-god-or-man-of-perdition.37087/page-4

 

[Ricko1]

Am not surprised that you noticed that I did not believe you....

Why I do not believe you? or at least am cautious.....

Reason :You seem to be fairly intelligent....

And yet: You have not clearly stated what your church practices in another locked thread

Not clearly answering that question gives me the impression that you are not being honest…. (although I give the benefit of the doubt that the reason can be how I post my question/observation is not clear)

So am reposting again:
see post# 77 of thread:
http://www.christianforumsite.com/threads/the-pope-man-of-god-or-man-of-perdition.37087/page-4

What does My Church Practice?

We teach and practice what Jesus and his original Apostles taught. We are The First Century Christian Church by definition and practices. We are known by many names such as a United Pentecostal Church or Apostolic lighthouse, or Church of The Lord Jesus Christ. Not every Church name maybe of the same practices or even the exact doctrine since some churches may not even practice the correct doctrine so " Name" is actually Irrelevent. UPC Churches are a group that believes the proper doctrine, however we are Independent of that group, and I have attended UPC Churches in the past while on vacation or traveling on buisness.