i know this but these offices are carried out through the preaching of the word not the name
I do not agree.
There is NO Apostolic office in the church today for the simply reason that no one today can meet the qualifications found in the Bible.
i know this but these offices are carried out through the preaching of the word not the name
i said it was carried through the office of the preaching of the word !!! what did the apostles teach/preach ? the Bible what do we preach teach the Bible . Paul wrote to Corinthian church i determined know nothing but Jesus Christ him crucified ..psst i never SAID THERE WAS Apostolic office. besides i dont have to be right about everything even tho i do try. the only thing i need be right on is iam savedI do not agree.
There is NO Apostolic office in the church today for the simply reason that no one today can meet the qualifications found in the Bible.
`When He (Jesus) ascended on high, He led captivity captive, and gave gifts to men......And He Himself gave SOME TO BE APOSTLES, SOME PROPHETS....` (Eph. 4: 8 - 11)I do not agree.
There is NO Apostolic office in the church today for the simply reason that no one today can meet the qualifications found in the Bible.
That is true and I agree. I do however believe that that Scripture refers to the 12 who Jesus commissioned to spread the Gospel in Mark 16.`When He (Jesus) ascended on high, He led captivity captive, and gave gifts to men......And He Himself gave SOME TO BE APOSTLES, SOME PROPHETS....` (Eph. 4: 8 - 11)
i said it was carried through the office of the preaching of the word !!! what did the apostles teach/preach ? the Bible what do we preach teach the Bible . Paul wrote to Corinthian church i determined know nothing but Jesus Christ him crucified ..psst i never SAID THERE WAS Apostolic office. besides i dont have to be right about everything even tho i do try. the only thing i need be right on is iam saved
thank you for your response time and effort. i have commented on all i care to post on . i dont ask you agree with me apparently you need to be correct have a good dayForgiven61.....It is much more involved than that.
Hi Major,That is true and I agree. I do however believe that that Scripture refers to the 12 who Jesus commissioned to spread the Gospel in Mark 16.
I guess I am trying to say that those original 12 Apostles were a special group who, were specifically chosen to lay the foundation of the church. In the early church the text of Scripture had not been written, and God used these foundational ministries to deliver the inerrant God-breathed Word to His Body, which is the Church - first verbally and then through the Word of God.
Whether or not there are apostles for today, depends on how the word "Apostle" is defined. Biblically, the word “apostle” literally means “one who is sent.” In that sense then yes, there could be an apostle today. So, anyone who was sent by the Lord to do something would be an apostle.
But, IMHO that is a very liberal definition of the word and again, IMHO just is not a sufficient answer. I am speaking about the 12 Apostles who Jesus personally commissioned so that Biblically, an apostle was someone who was involved with Jesus and/or knew of Jesus before his crucifixion and after his crucifixion. Consider the following two sets of verses.
Acts 1:21-22.........
“It is, therefore, necessary that of the men who have accompanied us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us— 22 beginning with the baptism of John, until the day that He was taken up from us—one of these should become a witness with us of His resurrection.
1 Corth.9:1.......
“Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord? Are you not my work in the Lord?”
i find this interesting while i do not hold to man self proclaimed titles apostles prophets . i took a look at what Adam Clarke had to say yes a commentator his thoughts Of note among the apostles — Whether this intimates that they were noted apostles or only highly reputed by the apostles, is not absolutely clear; but the latter appears to me the most probable. They were not only well known to St. Paul, but also to the rest of the apostles.Hi Major,
So you agree that when the Lord ascended He gave SOME APOSTLES... However the Lord chose the 12 BEFORE He ascended. (& later Matthias instead of Judas).
I wrote some of the Apostles the Lord gave AFTER HE ASCENDED -
`Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy.....as apostles of Christ.` (1 Thess. 1:1, 2: 6),
`Greet Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen and fellow prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who were in Christ before me.` (Rom. 16: 7)
Marilyn.
Thank you forgiven,i find this interesting while i do not hold to man self proclaimed titles apostles prophets . i took a look at what Adam Clarke had to say yes a commentator his thoughts Of note among the apostles — Whether this intimates that they were noted apostles or only highly reputed by the apostles, is not absolutely clear; but the latter appears to me the most probable. They were not only well known to St. Paul, but also to the rest of the apostles.
you have done your home work and a very good defense has been posted. while i have no dog in this discussion other than just a comment . it is interesting
much of the apostolic teaching i dont agree with but i do consider them part of the Body i pastor a Baptist CHURCH BUT ONLY PREACH the word . i do support the trinity teachingThank you forgiven,
As I was raised in the Apostolic denomination you would therefore think I should know of such. Thus said I do not believe of `men self proclaiming` they are Apostles, such as the NAR, (New Apostolic Reformation).
We NEVER called such and such Apostle ......, but pastor..... However the ministry gift of an apostle was/is recognisable. There are discernible spiritual, characteristics of an apostle.
much of the apostolic teaching i dont agree with but i do consider them part of the Body i pastor a Baptist CHURCH BUT ONLY PREACH the word . i do support the trinity teaching
Thank you forgiven, As I was raised in the Apostolic denomination you would therefore think I should know of such. Thus said I do not believe of `men self proclaiming` they are Apostles, such as the NAR, (New Apostolic Reformation). We NEVER called such and such Apostle ......, but pastor..... However the ministry gift of an apostle was/is recognisable. There are discernible spiritual, characteristics of an apostle.
Do you refer to the Apostolic group I was brought up with or the NAR?
Hello Marilyn;My husband and I are not in any denomination, but relate in house groups, and with ministers and people of all denominations. Thus said we believe (& was taught) -
1. Salvation through Jesus.
2. Water baptism for believers.
3. Holy living.
4. Infilling of the Holy Spirit.
5. Gifts of the Holy Spirit to edify, encourage and exhort.
6. Ministry gifts of the ascended Lord.
7. The Eternal Purposes of God through Christ.
I think you would believe most of those.
Yes, bob, that is the denomination, which came out of the Welsh Revival. My grandfather (Scottish)was mentored by men from the Welsh Revival. He was sent to Australia to help establish the Apostolic work there. (here). He became the President (leader) of the work in New Zealand and my uncle (grandfather`s son) became the President of the work here in Australia. Both were recognised Apostles, here and overseas.Hello Marilyn;
Please clarify for me. When you shared that you were raised in the Apostolic denomination, are you referring to the Apostolic Church? This is a denomination a little over 100 years old.
I don't feel you were describing the New Apostolic Reformation which is what would take more time to break down their combination of doctrines, denomination or movements, however, all pointing to the Trinity.
Or, are you and your husband currently not worshiping as a denomination, today?
The sacraments you listed are Biblical and important to learn and live in discipleship.
God bless you, Marilyn, your husband and family.
Correct. At the Great Commission Jesus, before He ascended spoke to 11 men.Hi Major,
So you agree that when the Lord ascended He gave SOME APOSTLES... However the Lord chose the 12 BEFORE He ascended. (& later Matthias instead of Judas).
I wrote some of the Apostles the Lord gave AFTER HE ASCENDED -
`Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy.....as apostles of Christ.` (1 Thess. 1:1, 2: 6),
`Greet Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen and fellow prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who were in Christ before me.` (Rom. 16: 7)
Marilyn.
thank you for your response time and effort. i have commented on all i care to post on . i dont ask you agree with me apparently you need to be correct have a good day
Yes, bob, that is the denomination, which came out of the Welsh Revival. My grandfather (Scottish)was mentored by men from the Welsh Revival. He was sent to Australia to help establish the Apostolic work there. (here). He became the President (leader) of the work in New Zealand and my uncle (grandfather`s son) became the President of the work here in Australia. Both were recognised Apostles, here and overseas.
As to my hubby and I, we are not in an Apostolic denomination, as there is none in our area. We used to travel a long way and stay all day, however we now work locally. Others have now joined us across this valley in 3 towns. Each has a core group that meet when able to. The focus is prayer, fellowship and receiving & appreciating of each other`s giftings. We reach out to others who do not go to a public meeting as well as unbelievers.
It is the 2 Timothy 2: 2 Principle. Paul (amid peers) - Timothy - faithful men - others. (great grandchildren as it were) You may know of your grandchildren and great grandchildren but you don`t `lord it over` them. They are mentored, (discipled) by their `father and mother` in the Lord. (as Paul, Timothy and Silvanus did, 1 Thess. 1: 1, 2: 7 & 11 ) .
We are not trammeled by business matters such as buildings, government regulations, finance, organising people, when and how and what fore etc they are to meet. No pew sitting, but all contributing and out in the community relating and walking with people in everyday life. And not just giving a pamphlet to a meeting, but actually relating with people through their ups and downs.
There are believers who have been elders in different denominations, who now work this way, plus other ministry gifts. We also have been invited to speak at a local denomination and also at their house meetings. We are not against public meetings run by organisations, however we do find working this way without the constraints of business matters, as what is needed in out area.
Hope that gives you some idea of how we operate.
Marilyn.
Thank you forgiven,
As I was raised in the Apostolic denomination you would therefore think I should know of such. Thus said I do not believe of `men self proclaiming` they are Apostles, such as the NAR, (New Apostolic Reformation).
We NEVER called such and such Apostle ......, but pastor..... However the ministry gift of an apostle was/is recognisable. There are discernible spiritual, characteristics of an apostle.
i am ending this at this moment my comments / discussion remarks was that the apostle office was filled in through the pastor/preacher preaching the word.. which is exactly what the apostles done. issue solved lets not get out of whack .you say you jumped the fence i say i crossed the fence. who is right? BOTH the fence was crossed in each others own wayForgiven61. I have NO desire to be correct and I have NO desire to argue with you. I do however have a desire to the Biblically correct on doctrinal issues, and you as an admitted pastor should feel that same need . IMHO.
a very interesting revival.. farmers so glorious saved the farm animals did not know how to react.the Welsh Revival.