Church Worship Music

You need to ask Him, what is he pleased with? What kind of music do YOU like Lord, what is pleasing to you?

Many in church seem to only care what is pleasing to themselves. I cant go along with that. People then get puffed up. Afterwards they ask you, did YOU enjoy the service? Well...its not about me...
 
When two or three gather in my name..im sure he didnt tell people there has to be a soundsystem and a drummer and a keyboard and electric guittar otherwise there wont be any worshipping going on.
 
aha said:
I got your point, and I agree, thanks for the Lamb, the Sacrifice in Jesus Christ….
Although, that will be an offering, sacrifice… and Sacrifice on the Cross is the once and for all…

On Worship:
As I understand, Worship, the root word: is acknowledgement of WORTH, Worthy of Praise…

I think it is context of Justice: to give to whom it is due…. we give Praise to a work of art, to lady for her beauty, not to flatter, but to give praise whom it is due, that is Justice : )

I think it is a personal thing HOW one give PRAISE to whom it is DUE… flowers? : )

I believe as well, we can sanctify our day to day activities, as an act of giving thanks, an act of praise, an act of worship....



Proverbs 3:6New King James Version (NKJV)
6 In all your ways acknowledge Him,
And He shall direct your paths.
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Thank you, that's interesting. Yes, our day to day activities, I think we ought to give glory to God in them. I would be very keen to guard the definition of what constitutes worship. We can glorify God in the way that we go about our daily lives here, in all sorts of activities, simply by the way we go about things, the manner of our conversation. Worship is something different though. I wouldn't restrict worship to when we're assembled, by any means, but it is purely spiritual in character. It is purely a heart-response to God, and nothing material or natural could add to that in any way.
 
Thats interesting that someone mentioned flowers. A lady at the church i went to did all the flowers.
Again out of love for the Lord. Not cos she wanted to show off or have it look pretty.

I do wonder what Jesus favourite flowers were, I think he liked lillies the best..i did grow some last year that flowered at Christmas.
 
geralduk said:
A lot of what is called worship music is not only a manipulation of the senses but its presentation is not unlike a rock concert.
The worship of God is the highest form of service we can give God it is also the very thing that the devil desires above all else .
The worship of God cannot be commanded into existence .Like you hear many a 'leader' saying lets now worship the Lord.
The worship of God commands the whole man and all himself. He is 'lost' in the worship of God . For there is none beside him .
But they that worship God must worship Him in Spirit and in truth.
Praise is not worship though it might lead to the worship of God.
It is as the Holy Spirit leads us to consider all that we know to be true about God and all that He is that we are led out into the worship of God.
It can only be done in the Spirit.
How then can a worldly unGodly rock concert either honour God or lead to the worship of God .More ;likely to the worship of man .
I once went to a crusade meeting in Wembly and all around the perimeter of the hall were stalls all selling various things .
One stall caught my eye . It was selling T shirts in a 'gothic' style with the lettering in old english as goths seem to like .
The words written on the T shirt ;I thought said "worship the beast" Shocked I took a double look and it actually read "worship the best" only one letter different but what a difference that one letter made.
Yet the stall and the T shirts were projecting one thing and the words said another .
"If any man be in Christ Jesus he is a new creation ,old things have passed away and behold all things have become new "
God does not make a goth a christian goth , or rock music ,christian rock .
If you are born of heaven then the life and the music will be inspired by heaven and the Holy Spirit not of the world or the devil come to that .
Some times it is slow sometimes it is faster .Sometimes not at all . But always honours God and in the Spirit .
in Christ
gerald
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I agree completely.
 
Cturtle said:
What are some examples of worship songs in your church Juk?
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I think they make the songs up themselves, so I cannot show you. But I can describe them as repetitive and focusing mostly on blessings (for the believer), and not God.
 
Grant Melville said:
Well, you probably know what my reply will be already... there's no office of worship leader spoken of in the scriptures. When we come together for the Supper, Christ Himself leads the praises to the Father, as it says in Hebrews 2:12: "I will declare thy name to my brethren; in the midst of the assembly will I sing thy praises."

What I'm trying to say here on this thread is that spiritual worship is of a totally different character to earthly worship. The outward things which attach to earthly worship aren't required. In the Old Testament, God deals with man in the flesh and as responsible under the Law. At the cross, that all changed. Man in the flesh was dealt with decisively, crucified with the Christ. A new order of man was introduced, a new order of worship too - in spirit and in truth.
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Worship leader an office? Come on. No, it is a ministry, just as teaching, or acting as a nursery room attendant, or as a pianist, or the audio-visual person, or parking lot attendant, or the custodial position of vacuuming, cleaning windows and scrubbing the toilets in the church bathrooms are ALL positions of ministry in the local church. We serve God and others.

What you are saying is superfluous to the actual acts of worship that we do, whether it is to serve breakfast to our spouse, or cut the neighbour's lawn, or to lift our hands in praise to the Lord Jesus Christ, or strum our bass guitar to give the music being played some rhythm and depth---they are all acts of spiritual worship. God doesn't draw a line under any of it and call it earthly, but somehow you do.

Your idea about a new order doesn't do away with musicality that is innate within us and is completely appropriate to offer to our Father. What you are advocating is legalsm and the very notion that instruments are somehow of the flesh, is an idea planted very deep within one's soul that is based on a lie, which emanates from some kind of fear.

We are FREE in Jesus! Free to worship Him fully engaging with our body mind and spirit! Anyone who says otherwise is not speaking from Truth.
 
Lanolin said:
Thats interesting that someone mentioned flowers. A lady at the church i went to did all the flowers.
Again out of love for the Lord. Not cos she wanted to show off or have it look pretty.

I do wonder what Jesus favourite flowers were, I think he liked lillies the best..i did grow some last year that flowered at Christmas.
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Flowers are of the flesh. If it isn't mentioned in the New Testament it is not of God.
 
Euphemia said:
Worship leader an office? Come on. No, it is a ministry, just as teaching, or acting as a nursery room attendant, or as a pianist, or the audio-visual person, or parking lot attendant, or the custodial position of vacuuming, cleaning windows and scrubbing the toilets in the church bathrooms are ALL positions of ministry in the local church. We serve God and others.

What you are saying is superfluous to the actual acts of worship that we do, whether it is to serve breakfast to our spouse, or cut the neighbour's lawn, or to lift our hands in praise to the Lord Jesus Christ, or strum our bass guitar to give the music being played some rhythm and depth---they are all acts of spiritual worship. God doesn't draw a line under any of it and call it earthly, but somehow you do.

Your idea about a new order doesn't do away with musicality that is innate within us and is completely appropriate to offer to our Father. What you are advocating is legalsm and the very notion that instruments are somehow of the flesh, is an idea planted very deep within one's soul that is based on a lie, which emanates from some kind of fear.

We are FREE in Jesus! Free to worship Him fully engaging with our body mind and spirit! Anyone who says otherwise is not speaking from Truth.
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This list of things which you say are spiritual worship - serving breakfast, mowing a lawn... those aren't acts of worship at all. We might well worship while we do them - I'm not ruling that out, but the things themselves are neither spiritual, nor acts of worship. As in the first two examples, we can glorify God by being a loving wife or husband, and by being a helpful neighbour. Glorifying God involves - among other things - our testimony, how we're seen by others. Worship is a different thing. The two things, while they might go on together, are different. We mustn't confuse them.

There are a lot of things innate in us that need done away with, otherwise we wouldn't need to be in a state of having put to death our members which are on the earth. No-one needs to be afraid of the flesh. We simply have to recognise it for what it is, and not give any opportunity to it. It's not through deception or fear that I say that we don't need any of these things we've been discussing in order to worship fully. It's because I know the all-sufficiency of Christ and the service of the Holy Spirit. The great giving of God has ensured that every believer can worship in spirit and in truth, no matter how poor they are, no matter if they have no status or education, no matter if they have no natural talents to speak of. None of these things are worth anything at all in the sight of the Father, and not one single human talent or ability will be taken into the eternal day. The Father only delights in the Son, and those that are His brethren, sons by adoption through the work of Christ. He delights to see features of that One in us.

We can present nothing of the old man to God and expect it to be acceptable to Him. That was Cain's error - he presented his own cultivation, the fruit of the cursed ground, to God. Abel was in the light of the worth of Christ - he presented the firstlings of the flock and their fat.
 
Euphemia said:
This is just nonsense.



What doctrine are you talking about? What is blasphemy to you?

That you would remain austere in your worship is a behaviour rooted in fear. Heaven will be a mighty shock for you.

Excuse me while I go and worship at church!

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If you can provide any scriptures which support these ideas, I'll gladly consider them. I was only saying that none have been provided so far.

The doctrine I'm referring to is that we can bring natural things to the worship of God. As I said, that is, in effect, saying that Jesus is not enough, that the Father's delight is not complete in Him. Christ alone won't do, we need Adam as well. Surely, it's clear that that's a blasphemous assertion?

I wouldn't call it austere... how could anything or anywhere be austere when Christ is at the centre of it? I can't imagine any deficiency or lack when He is there, any lack of resource when the Spirit is acting. We
get that truth in type in the Book of Esther:

"And when the turn of Esther, the daughter of Abihail the uncle of Mordecai, who had taken her for his daughter, came to go in to the king, she required nothing but what Hegai the king's chamberlain, the keeper of the women, appointed. And Esther obtained grace in the sight of all them that saw her." (Esther 2:15).

Hegai is a type of the Spirit here, and Esther is a type of the assembly. She needs nothing more than what the Spirit gives her to go in to the King. Will heaven be a shock? Not if we know the Lord Jesus and the Holy Spirit's blessed provision. Then we'll know, or we'll have a foretaste at least, of heaven's bliss. I think we get that especially at the Supper, when the Lord comes into the midst.
 
Cturtle said:
Juk? What is the purpose of renewing your mind to the things and promises of God?
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Romans 12:2 KJV
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

But I don't think those songs are edifying.
 
Grant Melville said:
This list of things which you say are spiritual worship - serving breakfast, mowing a lawn... those aren't acts of worship at all.
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This is where we diverge. God declares what we do with our bodies in service to Him as worship. when you realize the truth of this, you will be set free.

There are a lot of things innate in us that need done away with, otherwise we wouldn't need to be in a state of having put to death our members which are on the earth. No-one needs to be afraid of the flesh. We simply have to recognise it for what it is, and not give any opportunity to it. It's not through deception or fear that I say that we don't need any of these things we've been discussing in order to worship fully. It's because I know the all-sufficiency of Christ and the service of the Holy Spirit. The great giving of God has ensured that every believer can worship in spirit and in truth, no matter how poor they are, no matter if they have no status or education, no matter if they have no natural talents to speak of. None of these things are worth anything at all in the sight of the Father, and not one single human talent or ability will be taken into the eternal day. The Father only delights in the Son, and those that are His brethren, sons by adoption through the work of Christ. He delights to see features of that One in us.
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What God has placed within us as human beings, such as rhythm---our heart beat, our respiration, our eye blinks, our gait, the womb's 28-day rotation of readiness for offspring, our appreciation for rhythm and music---none of it is evil and none of it needs to be overcome! What is evil is succumbing to the enemy whispering in our ear that rhythm and music is inherently evil. God is the creator of music. Satan stole it. We, in Christ, take it back and use it for its rightful purpose: to bring glory to God.

In eternity, we will still be ourselves, and all our abilities that God has placed within us to serve Him will be completely magnified, and not only that, but the purposes for which we were created will be apparent as we serve Him in the Kingdom to come!

We can present nothing of the old man to God and expect it to be acceptable to Him. That was Cain's error - he presented his own cultivation, the fruit of the cursed ground, to God. Abel was in the light of the worth of Christ - he presented the firstlings of the flock and their fat.
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What we present to God is our whole selves. That you think it is unacceptable is acceptable to God!
 
Grant Melville said:
If you can provide any scriptures which support these ideas, I'll gladly consider them. I was only saying that none have been provided so far.

The doctrine I'm referring to is that we can bring natural things to the worship of God. As I said, that is, in effect, saying that Jesus is not enough, that the Father's delight is not complete in Him. Christ alone won't do, we need Adam as well. Surely, it's clear that that's a blasphemous assertion?
Click to expand...

Actually, what is blasphemous is to believe that one needs to withhold any of himself from God's use and purpose for His glory.

I wouldn't call it austere... how could anything or anywhere be austere when Christ is at the centre of it? I can't imagine any deficiency or lack when He is there, any lack of resource when the Spirit is acting. We
get that truth in type in the Book of Esther:

"And when the turn of Esther, the daughter of Abihail the uncle of Mordecai, who had taken her for his daughter, came to go in to the king, she required nothing but what Hegai the king's chamberlain, the keeper of the women, appointed. And Esther obtained grace in the sight of all them that saw her." (Esther 2:15).

Hegai is a type of the Spirit here, and Esther is a type of the assembly. She needs nothing more than what the Spirit gives her to go in to the King. Will heaven be a shock? Not if we know the Lord Jesus and the Holy Spirit's blessed provision. Then we'll know, or we'll have a foretaste at least, of heaven's bliss. I think we get that especially at the Supper, when the Lord comes into the midst.
Click to expand...

Heaven will certainly be a major shock to those who claim that musical worship involves only the vocal cords. When Holy Spirit is present, one would be hard pressed to say, "No, God, I will not dance before you, nor will I lift up my hands, nor shout praises to you, nor will I place my hand to the piano keys to adore you, even though you have blessed me with talent to play it." I doubt God is very pleased with that kind of attitude---it is disobedience!

He wants us all to experience Him in all ways and with exuberance. Our flesh should be brimming with excitement at being in His very presence!
 
Juk said:
Romans 12:2 KJV
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

But I don't think those songs are edifying.
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Maybe God does. It would be good if you could give us an example.
 
Euphemia said:
Actually, what is blasphemous is to believe that one needs to withhold any of himself from God's use and purpose for His glory.



Heaven will certainly be a major shock to those who claim that musical worship involves only the vocal cords. When Holy Spirit is present, one would be hard pressed to say, "No, God, I will not dance before you, nor will I lift up my hands, nor shout praises to you, nor will I place my hand to the piano keys to adore you, even though you have blessed me with talent to play it." I doubt God is very pleased with that kind of attitude---it is disobedience!

He wants us all to experience Him in all ways and with exuberance. Our flesh should be brimming with excitement at being in His very presence!
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I have seen you mention lifting hands quite a few times now.

Do you believe that is a requirement for worship or is that another freedom in Christ that we have the freedom to do or freesom not do.

Once in a while I lift my hands, but many times do not feel the press of the Holy Spirit to do so.
 
Euphemia said:
Post some lyrics, please.
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OK. No problem.

From.....http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/worshipsongratings.html
Verse 1:
God give me strength to make it through
Situations that sometimes get out of hand
I'll keep my eyes on You
I'll keep my eyes on You
Chorus:
My dreams may not come true
I may fall, I may fall on my face
Still my hope is in You
All I need is the strength to make it through
Verse 2:
God strengthen these hands that always hurt You
This mind that wanders and always gets out hand
I'll keep my eyes on You
I'll keep my eyes on You
Chorus:
My dreams may not come true
I may fall, I may fall on my face
Still my hope is in You
All I need is the strength to make it through
Like a breath in the fog my memories have disappeared
Like a breath in the fog my memories have disappeared
Like a breath in the fog my memories have disappeared
(I'll keep my eyes on you)
Like a breath in the fog my memories have disappeared
(I'll keep my eyes on you)
Like a breath in the fog my memories have disappeared
(I'll keep my eyes on you)
Like a breath in the fog my memories have disappeared
(I'll keep my eyes on you)
Chorus:
My dreams may not come true
I may fall, I may fall on my face
Still my hope is in You
All I need is the strength to make it through
My dreams they may not come true
I may fall, I may fall on my face
I may fall, I may fall,
I may fall, I may fall on my face".

I wonder what "like a breath in the fog my memories have disappeared" means since there is no mention of that concept or apparently the word "fog" in the Bible.
 
naomanos said:
I have seen you mention lifting hands quite a few times now.

Do you believe that is a requirement for worship or is that another freedom in Christ that we have the freedom to do or freesom not do.

Once in a while I lift my hands, but many times do not feel the press of the Holy Spirit to do so.
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We are moved by the Spirit of God on a personal level and if it is not of God to YOU personally to do it then make sure that you don't.

I have witnessed on several occassions adults doing this and a 3 or 5 year old child does it also..........not because the Spirit moved them because they saw mom or dad do it. I am not saying that is bad or wrong, just that it maybe for the wrong reason.
 
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